I was using a .17 HMR with a Zeiss scope (6x42) last evening, and could not see anything in a tree which was quite close - 30 metres away. Once I picked up the Swarovski Binos (10x42) the difference was incredible. Whilst I appreciate the difference in magnification etc.. I had not up until now noticed such a difference in the scope to bino comparison. Any suggestions for what people are using on top of their .17 HMRs please? I think I think I may need an upgrade?