Having a play with the rifle....CZ Varmint .17HMR just getting to grips....

TokaS

Well-Known Member
Got out this afternoon for a quick zero...it never seems an ideal time and the law of sod was doing its bit today as well...no sooner had i got my stuff together than it lashed down and the wind got up...lol
I manufacutred a quick portable target stand out of an old metal coat hanger and took my newly made shooting sticks with us.

my first two shots were at 35 yards....just a quick check to make sure it was nearly there.

happy it was still shooting ok, i moved it out to 100 yards. i kept the magnification at 12x and fired 3 shots. i could just see them at the top of the target...i was aiming for the centre.

that was the first grouping of three within 3/4" - i was happy with that! i also noted that using the mil dots it appeared to be the next one up from centre...so for the next 3 shots i used that mil dot and aimed for the centre of the target.
these three shots were just over 3/4" [1/4" high and 1 1/2" left of centre]

i then decided to move it out to 125 yards. [a zero at 36 yards should also give a second zero at 122 yards if the calculator is right, but in my past tests it didn't seem to be that way]

i got back to the rifle to find i had set the target too low to the ground, i couldnt see the bottom edge due to the grass, but i couldnt be bothered to walk out and lift it so i made do.....i fired off a few rounds [the 1 and 2 shot above and below the middle 3] before switching to 20x mag.
i then aimed the next 2 shots again using the 1st mil dot at a point centre high where the blue ring meets the white , the grouping was only just over 1/4", it was about 1/4" low though.

that was it for me though and i was happy with that...it was still 3" high at 125 yards which i thought strange but will see what happens when i get a good day to test it. Throughout this the wind was blowing directly from behind me [may be why the round was so high at 122yards?], it was strong and gusting so i think my new rest will do. I may remove the rubber and replace it with some thin leather just to cushion the rifle. the rubber did stop you adjusting it easily as it really gripped it too tightly.

anyway hope this makes sense....any comment welcomed....
 
I shoot a lot of 17HMR and leave it zeroed at 100 Yards. Get your rifle on a rest and give it a try on still morning. Do you have parallax adjustments on that scope of yours?~Muir
 
hi...thanks muir...yes i do have PA adjustment. i do use it. i had it on my .22lr rimmie till i got this and it worked fine out to 120 yards [on a good day]. the BRC program gives me other results and to be honest i didnt expect the results i am getting. i am hoping for a still day and i will go out and set up 5 or 6 targets at set ranges and see what sort of arc this is giving me!!?? a zero at 36 yards would suit me if it was only an inch high/low out to 140 yards but when i try to shoot this it is always a good 2.5" high betwen 80 yards and 122 yards???
it doesnt look as if we will have a still day for a while now....will have to stock up on ammo..lol

ATB
 
hi....17, not sure what the ballistic coefficient is...i am just using the preprogrammed data in the BRC program....

centre of scope is about 2" high of bore...

thanks
 
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It's hard to get an accurate ballistic picture without knowing the ballistic coefficient. The ballistic coefficient (or "BC") is a numerical designation given to a projectile that denotes its relative ability to slip through the air. a BC of "1.00" is, for this argument, the perfect projectile. All others are less. The BC of the 17 grain bullet is (if I remember right) .122 at sea level at 59F degrees. Speed of 2550 fps was used.

I generated this chart using default altitude and temp settings but it will be close.~Muir

Velocity: 2550
Target Distance: 100
Scope Height: 1.500
Temperature: 70
Altitude: 500

Ballistic Data
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Range Elevation Velocity Energy ETA Drop Max Y 10mph Wind Deflect
0 yds -1.50 in 2550 fps 245 fpe 0.000 sec 0.00 in -1.50 in 0.00 in
25 yds -0.49 in 2380 fps 214 fpe 0.030 sec 0.17 in -0.56 in 0.16 in
50 yds 0.13 in 2217 fps 186 fpe 0.063 sec 0.73 in -0.41 in 0.75 in
75 yds 0.32 in 2060 fps 160 fpe 0.098 sec 1.74 in -0.13 in 1.76 in
100 yds 0.00 in 1909 fps 138 fpe 0.136 sec 3.24 in 0.30 in 3.18 in
125 yds -0.93 in 1767 fps 118 fpe 0.177 sec 5.35 in 0.92 in 5.22 in
150 yds -2.58 in 1633 fps 101 fpe 0.221 sec 8.19 in 1.78 in 7.88 in
175 yds -5.00 in 1506 fps 86 fpe 0.269 sec 11.79 in 2.91 in 11.06 in
200 yds -8.43 in 1391 fps 73 fpe 0.321 sec 16.40 in 4.40 in 15.01 in
 
i played around with the BRC program and the only thing that gets the same practical results as i am getting is if the round is being fired at 3040fps [not 2550fps]??? i am on the lookout for lower mounts but all the medium height ones i have found up here are a couple of mm too low and the scope housig hits the barrel before it is seated properly...

ATB
 
well...went and had another play today. Wind light, sun out, ground rock hard and unomfortable...layed out markers with a tape measure so distances quite accurate today.
First 3 shots at 35 meters.
,so altered it till it was near zero.... A bit sloppy really but i was more interested in the 100/122 marks. So from this on i went out to 100 meters..., about 2" high and 2.2" left [poi was the lower right cross].
So i started to bring it back over... and then decided to try out to 122 meters.
..seemed a lot more like it with the height...i managed to bring the grouping over to the right [cant find the pic for that...] and did a couple of shots at 80m, by now i was begining to sweat with the walking back and forth and i was running out of time [always the case when i need to be relaxed..lol],back to 50m and this and finally back to 35m . then to tidy up and go...

still it should have been zeroed at 122m but it is firing about 1" high [i can live with that]. i do think it is my firing of the rifle that is throwing it high and i hope with practice i can sort that. these shots were taken off my attached bipod/prone. It will need a clean now and i will see if that affects the group, i may even try a diffeent ammo to see if it tightens anything up but want to sort my firing first....

thanks
 
My mate & I found the 17grain totally useless in both his Sako & my CZ, similar to the groups you posted, 20 grain in his Sako are one hole @ 100, my CZ gives a little less accuracy, but will still poke out bunny eyes @100. Steve.
 
My mate & I found the 17grain totally useless in both his Sako & my CZ, similar to the groups you posted, 20 grain in his Sako are one hole @ 100, my CZ gives a little less accuracy, but will still poke out bunny eyes @100. Steve.

I found exactly the same with my cz varmint and had to change to 20grain rounds to get a sensible group. My dads 17hmr has a longer barrel and seems to handle the 17grain rounds a bit better than my varmint with the shorter barrel. Neil
 
hi..thanks will try differring brands of 17grain and try a box of the 20grain to test. will update once i have done it...i am still killing rabbits cleanly out to 120 yards as it is but i want it to be as good as it can!!

atb
 
Hi, Why are you zeroing at 35 yards? i go the other way i zero to 120yds and shoot rabbits out to 180yds i'f i'm shooting close up I take the 22lr with subs wich does a quieter and cleaner job from 30 to 100 yds. The ammo i use in my CZ .17HMR varmint barrelled is remmington gold tips i get better groups at 120yds than the ones you have at a 100. my scope is 1 1/2 inches above centre barrel and i get 4 inch drop at 200yds which falls lucky as it's it's the first mill dot on my recticle. This round is a fantastic long range bunny basher although a bit noisy but that doesn't matter at 120 yards with a good mod fitted.
good luck.
Monty.
 
I am with some of the others on the method
I dont trust the data to assume a double zero point from the closer one even with trial and error.

In my experience of that with other rifles it is always off. I would much rather KNOW what it does when zeroed at 100 and then shoot it at 50, 75, 125, 150 and everything in between from all manner of positions so you know exactly what it can do.

one thing that I like to do is use polystyrene pizza bases. they will stick to a tomato stake in the ground with a single drawing pin.
take several and stake them all out at the set distances, saves you walking back and forth and if you put them close to the same line you can shoot from one, consistent shooting position.
 
hello there i shoot and love my 17hmr its a cz bruno varmint barrel the best rounds ive found and ive tried nearly all of them now is the 17 gr hornady i zero my bang on at 50 yrds i usually get about 1/2 inch group 5 rounds once im happy i just move up one click which is 1/8 of inch at 100 yrds and mine kills out to as far as i can see day or night with the hawke 3x9x50 scope and the 3 mates i know have them all zero the same way stu
 
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:eek:
i usually get abot 12/ inch group 5 rounds

A one foot group at 50 yards :eek:.

i just move up one click which is 1/8 of inch at 100 yrds and mine kills out to as far as i can see day or night with the hawke 3x9x50 scope

Ahhh I see a Hawke scope then that probably explains a lot.. You don't shoot very far with one of those :stir:. Sorry ole chap but having brought one and tried it I would not have one as a gift.
 
hello there i shoot and love my 17hmr its a cz bruno varmint barrel the best rounds ive found and ive tried nearly all of them now is the 17 gr hornady i zero my bang on at 50 yrds i usually get abot 12/ inch group 5 rounds once im happy i just move up one click which is 1/8 of inch at 100 yrds and mine kills out to as far as i can see day or night with the hawke 3x9x50 scope and the 3 mates i know have them all zero the same way stu

Stu: It's all Hornady. If it's a 17 grain ballistic tip it's made by Hornady. How far do you shoot and what kind of hold over do you use?~Muir
 
Muir hi , Your correct in the facts that hornady load all th .17HMR rounds but other makers specify the powder and burn rates remmington gold tips are the same 2550 fps as hornady and they group at 1/2 inch at hundred yards in flat calm weather, where as the hornady a max group at around 1 1/4 inches at 100 yds. i must say though that this is my rifle and rifles do vary even the rifles of the same make hornady varmint rounds (v-max) i wouldn't use because after 80yds they seem to be all over the place not what you want for vermin and to be able to achieve clean kills.
I only shoot at what i can kill cleanly and with the remmington gold tips it's anything i can see up to 180 yds. give em a try you won't be disappointed.

all the best .

Montysnipersmilie.gif
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Muir hi , Your correct in the facts that hornady load all th .17HMR rounds but other makers specify the powder and burn rates remmington gold tips are the same 2550 fps as hornady and they group at 1/2 inch at hundred yards in flat calm weather, where as the hornady a max group at around 1 1/4 inches at 100 yds. i must say though that this is my rifle and rifles do vary even the rifles of the same make hornady varmint rounds (v-max) i wouldn't use because after 80yds they seem to be all over the place not what you want for vermin and to be able to achieve clean kills.
I only shoot at what i can kill cleanly and with the remmington gold tips it's anything i can see up to 180 yds. give em a try you won't be disappointed.

all the best .

MontyView attachment 14041
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Hi Monty,
Marine PMI of this board and I were shooting HMR testing barrels before it was commercially available. I / we have shot everything there is in HMR over the years so I've probably tried it already.

As to the quote in red: It is a common myth that the various labels would like you to believe. The various makers state that their label is loaded to "...our specifications..." which is always the same as Hornady's specifications, other than the color of the tip. Same powder, same priming, same bullet; same machines. What you are most likely seeing is LOT to LOT variations in quality control.~Muir
 
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