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Thread: Telegraph artical worth a read.

  1. #1

    Telegraph artical worth a read.

    Is this about a disgruntled former stalker or does he have a point.

  2. #2
    The debate about lead/non lead amo is rather pointless as we don't know the facts/detail of this particular case. But I think it is fantastic that, after all the recent bad hunting PR, there has now been some exposure that conservation charities such as the RSPB actually control deer on their land. This will make the anti's think, I hope.
    A few wisdom's:
    • Do not be seduced by the marketing-men
    • If you can get closer, get closer.
    • If you can get more stable, get more stable.

  3. #3
    Not wishing to start a debate on calibres but purely out of interest does anyone know the calibres concerned that were used? A French bullet manufacturer told me some time ago that they had problems making non lead bullets in smaller calibres that were actually effective on larger game and that it was pretty much work in progress to develop suitable smaller calibre bullets.
    It's the calibre of the shooter that counts not the calibre of the rifle.

  4. #4
    Has anyone read the evidence based scientific trial ?Whats your thoughts Bryn?

  5. #5
    Colonel Johnny is a first-class chap. I used to go beating for him on the Lulworth ranges pheasant shoot.

  6. #6
    sounds like it was a girly .243 causing the problem rather than the bullet!

  7. #7
    Yes, he has a point.
    More broadly, there is an issue over the level of micro-management by organisations like the RSPB that is driven by PR rather than science.

  8. #8
    Distinguished Member Ronin's Avatar
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    Oct 2014
    Lancs / Cumbria Border
    Ive been using copper exclusively for a number of years, there can be issues with using "like for like" bullet weights (e.g. a 150g copper solid in a 308 vs a 150 g jacketed bullet)

    You MUST use lighter weight projectiles to get the bullets to expand reliably - some manufacturers bullets are better than others, I now use lathe turned solids from GS custom, they are so far entirely reliable.

    Where I would normally use a 130 g jacketed projectile, I use a copper 95 / 103 grainer

    If you read the article in the Telegraph, it appears there are two issues - the first it apparently being a disgruntled "ex stalker", the second the terminal performance defects were noted when "small calibre" rifles (whatever that means) were used.

    Im not sure if that reads "deer legal" - I'm sure that it was,,however, maybe the stalker in question didn't do research and testing before using the ammunition on live quarry.

    Ive no issues with copper and I've been using it effectively for 6 + years on roe, fallow, red and sika.

    The secondary issue is if anyone had ever seen a X ray of a whole carcass thats been shot with a jacketed bullet, you'd turn to copper immediately (I have) and was amazed at the distribution of lead particles in a large area around the wound channel...........

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by bryn View Post
    Is this about a disgruntled former stalker or does he have a point.
    Possibly a retired stalker. I'm thinking he may be well into his 70's by now. No doubt there are a few SD members who know him. I doubt anyone would dare bring up this sort of thing while they were actively associated with a supplier of their sport, for fear of losing it. Typical of the media to give the RSPB the last word.

  10. #10
    Isn't Arne all Sika ? Not exactly renowned from dropping dead when shot with a .243 whatever type of bullet is used.

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