View Poll Results: Should DMQ shoot test be harder

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  • yes

    27 26.73%
  • no

    74 73.27%
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Thread: Level 1 DMQ shoot test

  1. #1

    Level 1 DMQ shoot test

    OK another thread has inspired me to ask "set up pole"

    Is the shoot test done on level 1 DMQ sufficient ie.... should it be harder and if so how
    Smaller target?
    Longer range?
    Timed?
    Timed follow up shot?
    Any other suggestions?
    Regards
    Jimmy
    Next time you're walking down the street and see a homeless person go buy them a sandwich and a coffee, change of fate and it could be you one day !!!

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by jimmy milnes View Post
    OK another thread has inspired me to ask "set up pole"

    Is the shoot test done on level 1 DMQ sufficient ie.... should it be harder and if so how
    Smaller target?
    Longer range?
    Timed?
    Timed follow up shot?
    Any other suggestions?
    Regards
    Jimmy
    I'm not in the UK, and therefore haven't done DSC1, but may I ask why you think a harder test is necessary? Have a large number of deer been wounded by DSC1 holders recently? Or do you feel that too many people are passing the course?

  3. #3
    Interesting question. I think they should put head and neck shooting in it and a representative target area, maybe against a scenario. For example, positioning a deer target and the student is asked would they take the shot. If it is yes, then where would they aim and how would they do it, then get them to do it. Maybe not as part of the shooting test per-se but as a practical element. Maybe then show them pictures of what can go wrong. It's a bit gruesome but for warned is for armed.

    What about mother and calf scenario, shoot the calf then mother in a timed scenario. Again, not part of the shooting test but a practical element.

    Not necessarily make the test harder but add more to the practical elements.
    Last edited by Wills; 07-10-2016 at 07:49.

  4. #4
    Jimmy as you know I have seen many shooting tests and at this moment I think DMQ have set a very good base standard of shooting. The problem lies with how it is conducted and what is allowed . For example we have many who turn up with rifles that will not shoot .They then need to use the range officers rifle and that shows that we have a problem. We also have some coaching from assessor that should not be allowed in my opinion. This will be so that there course is seen as the best, We need standards to be maintained at all times and im sure more would fail but it would be the ones that could injure a deer with there pour quality equipment. Jimmy the shooting test still allows 3 goes at each standard and this to me is a worry .
    As I get older I have realised that I cannot please everyone. But I find I can easy piss every one off.

  5. #5
    Although I had a great deal of experience with shotguns I had never fired a centre-fire rifle before sitting my DSC1 (about 15 years ago). I would strongly advise anyone thinking of taking the DSC1 to take a shooting lesson first if they don't have much/any rifle shooting experience. I was presented with an unmoderated .270 with a stupidly short stock & eye-relief & promptly cut myself, although I did at least pass first time.
    Last edited by McKenzie; 07-10-2016 at 08:09.

  6. #6
    I agree that the test isn't especially hard, but it's supposed to be a simulation of possible real life scenarios. The target is the correct size to represent a deer and the ranges are realistic of the distance it's possible and likely to encounter deer, so why change it?
    If somebody can hit a target half as big from twice as far away then that's great, but it's irrelevant.
    See my blog for - My kindly sponsored DSC1 course and chart my progress from deer virgin to stalking veteran
    AND my new puppy progress DIARY
    Blog

  7. #7
    Why should it be harder?

    Smaller target? why? It covers the cull area , if a candidate can hit that it should be sufficient
    Longer range? definatley not! it covers normal stalking ranges, there is a!ready a provision in DMQ where all the candidates are hill stalkers for the initial target to be at 150 metres.

    Timed? certainly? not again its supposed to simulate a stalking situation, your shot should not be rushed when stalking
    so why should it be rushed when taking a test.

    A follow up shot ? maybe but not sure how it would best be done.

    I believe there are more people fail the shooting test than any other part of DMQ 1 but I don't believe its necessarily because they are poor shots,nerves can play a big part.

    Just to illustrate the point that nerves can play, when taking clients on the hill they all had to shoot at the target we had a full size stag target this was shot at from 150 yards, the target were shot marks on the target from end to end , and many clients who managed to miss the target completely, purely down to nerves

    No amount of tinkering with the test will do anything to help with nerves, this is where target shots may have an advantage over stalkers as they are used to shooting in front of others.
    Last edited by bogtrotter; 07-10-2016 at 08:15.

  8. #8
    DSC1 is in reality a base level for deer stalkers and the ability to pass the existing test is fit for that purpose, perhaps there ought to be an advanced shooting test available as an add-on incorporating simulated field conditions, e.g. slightly wobbly uncomfortable high seat, cramped position through a wire fence or gate, etc.

    Ian Farrington (IanF on SD) does some really useful coaching for practical shooting positions.

    atb Tim

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Wills View Post
    Interesting question. I think they should put head and neck shooting in it and a representative target area, maybe against a scenario. For example, positioning a deer target and the student is asked would they take the shot. If it is yes, then where would they aim and how would they do it, then get them to do it. Maybe not as part of the shooting test per-se but as a practical element. Maybe then show them pictures of what can go wrong. It's a bit gruesome but for warned is for armed.

    What about mother and calf scenario, shoot the calf then mother in a timed scenario. Again, not part of the shooting test but a practical element.

    Not necessarily make the test harder but add more to the practical elements.
    This is already covered in the walk around with an examiner.

    I put no in my reply. As some of you may be tired of hearing, the conditions when I did mine were vile, freezing cold and very very windy indeed with the accompanying driving sleet, tougher conditions would have been really difficult.

    David.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by 6pointer View Post
    Jimmy as you know I have seen many shooting tests and at this moment I think DMQ have set a very good base standard of shooting. The problem lies with how it is conducted and what is allowed . For example we have many who turn up with rifles that will not shoot .They then need to use the range officers rifle and that shows that we have a problem. We also have some coaching from assessor that should not be allowed in my opinion. This will be so that there course is seen as the best, We need standards to be maintained at all times and im sure more would fail but it would be the ones that could injure a deer with there pour quality equipment. Jimmy the shooting test still allows 3 goes at each standard and this to me is a worry .
    Pretty much covers my thoughts.
    www.anglocustomrifle.co.uk
    Anglo deer management and training
    Yet another 7mm 08 user ..................... if Carlsberg made calibers.........................

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