seen it and might be of interest to southerners. Pity she was not closer
seen it and might be of interest to southerners. Pity she was not closer
That might be the right dog for some one and certainly at the right price. Just ready to train.
I am a bit confused here.
I own labs, cockers and a GWP. I have on occasion bred from mine but not before going through the expected and necessary checks to ensure the intended bitch was suitable, eyes, hips etc. I then chose an appropriate stud, also checked and healthy. I then ensure that the litter gets the best possible start in life. That means regular worming, good (expensive) puppy food and so on. In other words there are significant costs involved.
All my dogs are probably of a similar price when it comes to selling pups, around £500-£600 for a bitch and perhaps a bit less for a dog. I have looked into BMH's as I have considered one as my next deer dog when the GWP is too old. I contacted a couple of breeders and discussed this. One of them emailed me back and attached a standard info list which included the price. £1000 for a dog and £1500 for a bitch pup at, I assume, 8 weeks old.
I was certainly under the impression that a bitch was going to cost around the £1000 mark and would happily pay the asking price for the right animal.
Therefore, does £400 not suggest that something is not quite right? I always feel that if a prospective buyer is outlaying a lot of money for a pup, then the decision has been reached after a lot of careful thought before the deal is done. A cheap animal could be bought on a whim and just as quickly got rid of. No big deal really if only worth a couple of hundred quid. That is one of the reasons why I would never discount a pup if asked. Nothing to do with making a few extra pounds. Granted, if it's to a friend who I know and trust then the consideration would be different.
I am interested to hear what others who have dogs, in particular BMH's have to say about this.
Jamross 65 what you might be doing is makeing sure the homes your dogs go to are not suitable at all, just because your pups are expencive and only the mega rich can afford them certainly dose not make a good home. When i bred my WHV they all went to good working homes and the price was kept at the low end . I had contact through the internet and all stayed at there respective homes. Rich people have whims more so that the pourer more caring. I am sorry mate looks like you a bout the money The HWV now is in my opinion ruined because a large price was put on its head . Breeders and dog peddlers got a hold of a good working breed with a fantastic temprament and bred it out of the reach of the working guy.
Buyer beware, certainly need to get pup checked out, ie vet check and inoc. card. There was a case where a farmer was looking on preloved for pets free to good home. Immediately advertised them as circumstance change forces sale springer spaniel 4 year old £75 home more important than money. Turned out to be seven, and agressive possessive. The womans daughter and grandchild came to live with her. The dog had to go as it was taking the kids toys and agressively protecting them from the kid when the child wanted them back. A family with a one year old daughter bought the dog. The woman dropped an empty vasaline jar. The dog guarded it for half an hour growling She paid a fortune and in vets bills for ailments and injections then had to put it in to yorkshire springer rescue. I said the dog was there. I don't advise anyone to knock at the door with cash. Anyone who works in dog rescue will tell you most rescues carry baggage, but most respond to experienced handlers,
Sorry, but disagree. I don't charge a lot of money for pups. I charge what the going rate is for that breed otherwise I wouldn't be able to sell them as there would be others out there cheaper. For the record, in over 20 years of owning 9 different dogs, I have only had 4 litters of pups. 2 of the litters were because friends wanted a dog from her and another 2 were because I wanted a pup from those particular dogs.
I also cannot see how it is only the mega rich that can now afford to buy a dog at £500. I work for a living and and have a family to support. If I set my mind on owning something I will save up for it, perhaps keeping the cash from my dog work, sale of venison etc, then when I do get it I make sure I look after it as I cannot afford to just pop out and buy another one.
What I can see happening with this BMH is, someone picking it up for £400 and turning it over for £1500. I genuinely hope if it is bought it is by someone who really wants one to work but cannot afford the normal asking price. Too many times I have heard the owners of crap dogs on shoots talk about a litter of pups being planned. No health checks, just the litter seen as cash. Then the poor unsuspecting prospective buyers pick up a cheap lab, fall in love with it and at 9 months get hit with the news from the vets that as it has hip displaysia the medication and painkillers are going to cost £150 a month for the rest of its painful life as they cannot bring themselves to put it to sleep. This is not made up scenarios, I have friends who have been there.
Sorry, but if a deal seems too good to be true, then generally it is...
As a BMH owner I can only relate to my own experience of the purchase. After having seen a BMH and falling for the breed I contacted Mark Montgomery at Paintandpins. As an experienced breeder and handler of the breed Mark wanted to know why I wanted one, my experience with dogs and exactly my plans for it's future. I had no problems with this as I can fully appreciate and understand what he was trying to achieve. BMHs are not bred as a pet dog, they are bred to track blood in a working environment. They need understanding, conditioning,an experienced handler to bring out their full potential and most importantly they need to be regularly worked. But for whatever reason, they, to some extent have become the "in" dog to have. This does the breed and an individual dog no good whatsoever.
Now an assumption. Basildon - I could imagine the seller of this dog being fairly well off and being a recreational now and again stalker. Not the best placement for a BMH. I paid £900 for my dog. At 9 months he had been conditioned by the breeder and myself to be totally deer orientated. He had recovered a few deer, was out stalking every time I was and although he still had a lot to learn and experience, was what I would consider at this age a very good prospect. I am not going to call him part trained as you do not train a BMH to track. He must learn to deal with situations and gain experience. It is a pure partnership.
If I had been selling this dog at 9 months I would have been looking at a fair bit more than the purchase price, not less.
Another assumption - the seller of this dog has bought her to have the "in" deer dog. Has not had a clue on how to bring out the potential of the breed and dog, it has become a nuisance because it is not doing what it should be doing (tracking deer) and is not getting on with the owners other dog, the owner is probably getting hassle from his partner and hence advertise the dog at a "to sell" price.
The future of a dog like this will depend very much on a new owner having the knowledge nad experience to get it back on track (pardon the pun). It is a situation where I believe the new owner rather than cash should be the uppermost in the sellers mind. I would think he should seek advice from either the breeder or someone like Mark Montgomery for nothing else than future of this young dog.
Last edited by Gazza; 25-02-2011 at 22:11.
Great Post Gazza but sadly a happy ending for most of the in dogs in the future is not on the cards.
I know I have sent you a pm and await a response however, I share this concern and hopefully my explanation to you will highlight that.
Like Gazza, I also spoke to Paintandpins but on that occasion it was Marks wife. I explained to her I was not a novice handler having trained all my own dogs, and entered a novice stake with one of them. What I did tell her though, was that I had no clue what so ever about this breed, but like the above post, also had a desire to own one in the future. My GWP is only 7 years old and do not currently need 2 deer dogs. If I am being honest, she almost put me off! Not because I didn't think I could train/work/bond with the breed, but more because it may not fit as well within my stalking/living/working life.
One concern that would remain however is, assuming that Gazza is correct on the lack of knowledge of the breed issue by the current owner, then is it possible that some damage could have been done that may not be retrievable?
Gents, I have just rang about this dog. It has no papers and it possibly came from Sussex? Is it me or does something not sound right!? Having worked a fair bit in "Basvagas" I can tell you I lock my truck!