Old rifles vs. modern models

Roch

Well-Known Member
Hi,
I would like to hear from you if the old sakos (75),sauers (80,90) etc. were better built than the modern versions ? What’s your opinion?
 
Rumour has it that the Sako 75's are much better than the newer 85's which is lucky as I have a couple of 75's!
I'm sure that modern technology such as computer controlled lathes etc have revolutionised the firearm industry and they certainly don't 'make them like they used to'!
Accuracy has probably improved but looks may have taken a dive. I prefer accuracy and reliability to looks.
MS
 
Ok then the modern rifles perform better but are they more reliable, they will last like the old ones?
 
Ok then the modern rifles perform better but are they more reliable, they will last like the old ones?
Stainless steel, synthetic stocks, non/less corrosive powders, coated bullets, better lubricants/protective coatings, etc.....
I'd say they'll last a while!;)
MS
 
Today in Bisley I was shooting a 134 year old rifle. I wonder if any of the T3s or Howas will last that long.
 
I shoot with a Sauer 200 and have done so for the last 20ys, the rifle is about 30yrs old with a old SB scope. Five years ago we down sized (house) and had a bit of money spare so I bought a new 202 with a kaps Scope. The build quality on the old model is better than the new one and when my hand goes in the gun safe I alway end up pulling the old one out. The old one and me are good mates, I could never sell it.
 
Sako 75 would not consider them old, I have an A11 and IMO its better built than the 75s

Are modern rifles better, too much plastic and aluminium in my opinion which makes a rifle cheaper to produce
does not make it any cheaper to buy, are modern rifles more reliable? I doubt it, will they last longer I don't think so.:old:
 
In a word Yes!But comparatively modern rifles are a lot cheaper than the old days. Where I think the big difference is is that today's "cheap" rifles are a lot more accurate than old out of the box rifles. Modern machine tools in particular CNC allow much closer tolerances to be built in, whereas to get that quality in the past would have required a high degree of manual skill. I would suggest the action of a modern T3 or Howa etc is a lot squarer / closer to the blue print than the budget rifles of the past. Whether they are tougher etc is a moot point. A lot of that will depend on the user and most old rifles we see around today are actually little used, or well maintained. There must be hundreds/thousands of Parker hales/ enfields etc that were working rifles that were used and abused in their lifetime and have to the great smelter in the sky.
 
Got a sako 75 when they came out thought they were good then, had a notion to go british as i have a lot of old english guns so i did .
The quality wasnt bad (parker hale ltw 1100 ) and the rifle had not seen much work sd member said about 100rds , but no way would it shoot as good as my pevious sako or remmy's etc.
The bore scope showed why there were lots of tooling marks and a damaged section of rifling the smith said less than good factory quality control.
Went back to the 75 varmint for my foxing and roe , then splashed out on another std 75 in .308 for larger quary, chopped them both back to 20" and fitted cmm4 mods .
Over the moon with the rifles both shoot well and have quality wood, good blued metal work for mid range rifles they handle really nice too for moderated firearms.
You won't go wrong with a 75 or any other older sako i dare say. DF
 
i wouldnt really class the sako 75 as an old model it came out in 1997 , the 85 in 2006 so not a great deal of time in between. i have an 85 very nice and quality is top notch, never used a 75 but could only imagine they are as good, for old models would have thought Sako A1 compared to 85/75 would give a better old/new comparison, sure someone will have both models to compare against, edit just read bogtrotters reply:D
cheers
craig
 
Got a sako 75 when they came out thought they were good then, had a notion to go british as i have a lot of old english guns so i did .
The quality wasnt bad (parker hale ltw 1100 ) and the rifle had not seen much work sd member said about 100rds , but no way would it shoot as good as my pevious sako or remmy's etc.
The bore scope showed why there were lots of tooling marks and a damaged section of rifling the smith said less than good factory quality control.
Went back to the 75 varmint for my foxing and roe , then splashed out on another std 75 in .308 for larger quary, chopped them both back to 20" and fitted cmm4 mods .
Over the moon with the rifles both shoot well and have quality wood, good blued metal work for mid range rifles they handle really nice too for moderated firearms.
You won't go wrong with a 75 or any other older sako i dare say. DF

I wonder how tooling marks got into a hammer forged barrel. Still sounds like someone had damaged it somehow.
 
Brit you know the same rifle im just going on what the rifle smith with the bore scope who builds them day in day out said, his verdict was the damage was done when the rifling was cut.
Before you jump on me im not knocking british made guns had literally hundreds of them still have a few, i liked the looks of these p/h rifles suppose i just had a bad un.
Anyway sako 75's work for me . DF
 
I have a new RPA hunter and an old Lee Enfield (Similar to Envoy/L42) both in 0.308/7.62. The RPA is more accurate, but no where as nice to shoot as the Enfield. The Enfield is more than accurate enough for stalking where the RPA is better for paper punching, With care they will both out last me!
Also have a Sako 75, but consider that a new rifle.
Mick
 
I like my Sako 75 Varmint 7mm-08 it shoots nicely and is accurate. Looks wise the L691 6.5x55 and S491 .222 were very pretty and still shot well, the L691 ended up shot out. The S491 I sold and am still kicking myself about it.
 
I see the 75 as a reasonably modern rifle, by a long way!

If I was forced to shoot 75's until the day I died, I'd die a happy man.
 
The older Sakos and Tikkas definately look and feel better but are no more accurate than the newer versions.

IMHO
 
Brit is right, the rifling isn't cut in a hammer forged barrel. The whole bore shape and size is formed at the same time on the mandrel. Tool marks means later work.

David.
 
I too have both a Sako 75 and 85, which I bought new. Build quality seems identical. The only noticeable difference is the magazine release catch. I am very satisfied with both rifles and would not part with them.
 
Brit you know the same rifle im just going on what the rifle smith with the bore scope who builds them day in day out said, his verdict was the damage was done when the rifling was cut.
Before you jump on me im not knocking british made guns had literally hundreds of them still have a few, i liked the looks of these p/h rifles suppose i just had a bad un.
Anyway sako 75's work for me . DF

Yes I remember the discussions about it but the way a hammer forged barrel is made pretty much precludes marks like you had. They gun drill and ream then insert the former and put it through the forging mill. The rifling is formed under tons of pressure and it's normal for hammer forged barrels to have a mirror finish. As the rifle had to pass proof before being finished, P-H submitted them in the white, any such damamge should ahve been picked up in proof as the barrel would have been out of spec.

A chap has just had the proof house refuse to proof a rifle because he has had a Mannlicher Schoenauer re-built into a fine custom rifle using an American speced 6.5mm bore. This is too tight in the rifling to meet the 6.5x54MS specs held at the proof house so they refused to proof it. The only way they could have found this is to have measured the bore.

Sure P-H produced some not so good but I still find it hard to believe such damage not only slipped through their inspection but also passed the proof house inspection as this indicates very sloppy inspection is two established places.

Some how the whole story before you brought it has not been told I am afraid. I wonder if a sqib load got a bullet stuck and whoever removed it did the damage.
 
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