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Thread: Estate Rifle

  1. #1

    Estate Rifle

    Hi Guys,

    I have been speaking to my local FLO and she has informed me that unless you are a landowner/occupier, servant of the landowner/occupier or a sporting lease holder (giving you sole rights to the deer management) that you would be unable to accompany a friend or client onto your land and allow them to use your own rifle under the estate rifle clause.

    I have about 15 farms (about 12,000 acres) that I regularly stalk on with clients as part of my job. She has said that I cannot accompany clients on this land and allow them to use my rifle under the estate rifle rule. Permission to shoot is not enough to qualify.

    If this is the case I'm sure this must be the most flouted law in firearms legislation!!!

    I would be very interested to hear anyones experience on this matter.


  2. #2
    I was told exactly the same by mine a bit back.


  3. #3
    That's how it is under the letter. You are right I am very sure it is flouted but that does not make it right. It shows the importance of a lease or license to be in place on land you stalk with guests/clients. Do others have 'permission' on your ground also other than the owner or occupier themselves ? If not I am sure a simple agreement document would suffice.

  4. #4
    Its how I have always understood it to be, though many people think they are OK to let someone use their rifle under the estate rifle clause, as others have said a much flouted exemption, and lets face it you are unlikely to be caught unless something goes wrong, which as we know sooner or later has habit of happening.

  5. #5
    servant of the landowner/occupier If you have full permision to control the deer then your are the servant of the landowner. I asked my FO and he said writen perrmison to say you are the autherised controller should be enough. Not one i would like to test in court.

  6. #6
    written permission with an extra bit like, 'and may be accompanied by a other persons when controlling deer' is all you need

  7. #7
    Its a stupid statement with little if any legal value. to define servant is not relevant in the discussion

    You either have permission to shoot on the land and if covering quarry, therefore "sporting rights" (a leaseholder or not as the case may be) or you dont.

    If you do there is no legal precedent to stop you from allowing anyone to use your rifle whilst under your supervision on land you are authorised to shoot on. (obvious exceptions where only the named leaseholder may shoot the deer on said lease).

    It doesn't matter if you are shooting paper or deer. If you have permission for whatever you are shooting and you recognise that YOU are going to be held legally responsible for the shot your friend is taking should it all go pear shaped then plink away.

    how would anyone start shooting if not under the supervision of people already doing it on land they currently shoot over!?
    they cant all be going to Bisley open days and then applying for an FAC!
    Last edited by bewsher500; 29-03-2012 at 13:41.

  8. #8
    While I am totally in agreement with your sentiments Brewsher it’s far from a simple matter and I think you may (strong emphasis on may) be mistaken on a couple of the legal points. I certainly wouldn’t like to argue the case either one way or the other and would suggest that mj robson would be best advised to consult the legal or firearms department of his shooting organisation which ever one that might be. It was mentioned in the original posting that if the FEO is correct then a lot of us may be breaking the law or have broken the law at some time in the past.

    If I remember the background to the “estate rifle” exemption correctly the wording that was included was actually done in such a way so as not to inconvenience the landed gentry who would invite friends without certificates to take a stag off their estates. I believe that there wouldn’t actually have been an estate rifle exemption if it hadn’t have been raised by one of the lords in the upper house when the legislation was going through parliament. It wasn’t really considered at the time that the likes of us oiks would like to get into stalking at some time.
    Last edited by 8x57; 29-03-2012 at 14:15.
    It's the calibre of the shooter that counts not the calibre of the rifle.

  9. #9
    BASC! They know the law better than most FEOs

  10. #10
    Mr Wallace works for NGO...

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