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Thread: Scope / rifle conundrum

  1. #1

    Scope / rifle conundrum

    I'd appreciate the advice of the forum on the following issue I am grappling with.

    I have two rifles; one in 30.06 (long barrel, wood stock, unmoderated) and one in 6.5x55 (short barrel, synthetic stock, moderated). The idea is for the former to be my 'hill rifle' for - primarily - reds in Scotland and the latter to be my 'woodland rifle', the primary use for which will be roe/fallow stalking down south.

    More by accident than design I have two Swaro 'scopes; a 3-12x50 Habicht (4a reticle) and a 2-12x50 Z6 (BRX reticle). The former I bought as a good all rounder and the latter I just happened to be offered at a good price, so I ended up with two very similar 'scopes mostly by accident; however there are enough differences that I feel that there is a careful decision to be made about which goes on which rifle.

    My thinking is this: The Z6 has the (marginal) edge in light transmission, which might suggest that it would go best on the woodland rifle as that is more likely to be used in dark, gloomy forest where the additional transmission would be helpful. However, the Z6 also has the BRX reticle which might be useful for the longer ranges one might encounter more often on the hill. To further muddy the waters, though I haven't yet tried this out properly, an unscientific test in my back garden suggests that the 4a reticle of the Habicht might show up better against a dark forest background than the thinner details of the BRX.

    For those not familar with the reticles see this link:

    Anyway, I throw the question open to the combined wisdom of the forum ! And yes, I appreciate that sticking with one rifle would have made the decision a lot easier...


    Mauser M03

  2. #2
    Those Z6's with the BRX reticules were basically dumped on the market heavily discounted to get rid of them. MacLeod's, Swillington and one or two others had them as job lots with some other unpopular reticule designs. I looked at them some time ago and really would not fancy that reticule for a hunting rifle at all.

    Assuming you are stuck with it, I would put it on the 30/06 if it is most likely to be used on the open hill. If you could trade it off for something more useful at a minimal loss, I would flip it.... Put it up on ebay.

    Just because you are paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you......

  3. #3
    Interesting, thanks CD. any other views on the BRX reticle ? I was told it was a 4a when I bought it so I could send it back; I just thought I'd wait to try it out before complaining.

  4. #4
    Correction - it is the BR reticle. In any event, I have just taken them out in the garden in the fading light and - subject to a live test to confirm - there is absolutely sod all between them. Because the BR has a solid top post - albeit thinner than the three solid posts of the 4a - that helps to guide the eye and the thin holdover markers just 'disappear', so it basically becomes a 4a / plea reticle in low light anyway. Given there is no appreciable difference in the light transmission actually makes me wonder about spending the extra money on the Z6 over the Habicht to be honest, though the Z6 does have an appreciably wider field of view to be fair. I'm going with CD's suggestion to put the Z6 on the 30.06 as the holdover markers could be useful on the hill.

  5. #5
    Is the Z6 with the BR first focal plane? If, then it could be usefull on the hill.
    If in second plane I'd flog it as it would lead to a cock up at some stage.
    The Habicht is a classic hunting scope and would suit your other rifle.

  6. #6
    Over the years, I have moved from 4A, to TDS 4 and am now using the BR reticles. I like the BR reticle and it does allow me to shoot on ranges for practice without having to make any adjustment to the stalking zero. I keep a .pdf of the ladder settings on my iPhone for reference. Regards JCS

  7. #7
    Thanks both for the responses. I was under the impression that all Z6's were in the 2nd focal plane (i.e. reticle appears to stay the same size throughout the magnificantion range). The Habicht is in the 1st focal plane (the reticle appears to get bigger on an increase in magnification).

    EJG, I assume by a cock up you are thinking of the situation where one forgets that the mil dots / markers will only be accurate for any given distance at one magnification. A valid point, though there also appear to be disadvantages to having a FFP scope. I'm sure that has been extensively debated on this forum so I'll have a look.
    Last edited by MauserM03; 14-08-2012 at 15:47. Reason: spelling

  8. #8
    I use the Swarovski calculator to produce these .pdfs, then stitch them together. This is the file I access on my iPhone. Regards JCS
    Attached Thumbnails Attached Thumbnails 260 ret 129 SP.pdf  

  9. #9
    Thanks, just had a play myself with the App and it looks very useful, albeit some of the longer ranges are a bit theoretical.

    There is a lot of debate on the first FP vs. second FP issue on other forums - looks like quite a minefield !!!

  10. #10
    Ref the focal plane business it is really personal preference. I always thought FFP was a bit odd in that the ret gets thicker the higher the mag, seems to be less precise to my eye. The reason for it I read is that the spacing on a german no4 reticule can be used as a range estimator based on the size of a Roe or Red deer.

    I prefer the SFP scopes, according to the Swarovski blurb, you need to use the scopes on maximum power if the TDS type reticules are to be relied on. Works for me at least. I was able to make first round hits on an 8" gong at 400 yards last weekend using the TDS on my 260.

    Just because you are paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you......

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