Police 'spot' checks

Seeing as my house is not a public place, none of the above is applicable.... if they need to get a warrant to enter a suspected drug dealers house or a travellers site, then they sure as hell ain't coming into my house without one.

Si- 'elsewhere than in a public place' covers your house, so it is very much applicable.
 
Regards entry, the Police need to be in possession of a Section 44 Firearms Act Warrant.
No Warrant, no entry......"officially"
 
Hi,
They turned up at his home, with no notice, to check his firearms and premises. He wasn't home. His mother showed them his cabinets and they then rang him to request his presence so that they could have them opened. On his return they did a comprehensive check, from ammunition count to cabinet fixing and found nothing amiss.

Maybe they were trying their luck. Dont forget that case a few years ago where some chap lived in london but kept his guns at his mothers house in essex. Police turned up unannounced asked to see the guns and it turned out she knew where he kept the key. She opened up the cabinet... and they promptly revoked his license for allowing unauthorised access. He took them to court and lost.

Moral of the story - dont tell partners / parents / pets / children where you keep your key. And make sure even if they THINK they know, dont tell the police!
 
If it was at a sociable hour ! (not the middle of the night) as you say.

I for one being a law abiding gun owner, would'nt have an issue, to be honest how many would refuse them entry. ?

Same here, I have no problem with a scheduled visit but to turn up when I'm out and the kids are in bed is unacceptable and they would have to arrange a more convenient time.
 
I've just asked about this, the reply I have received states:

"Thanks for your enquiry. You are correct in your assumption that we would have no power of entry to just turn up and do a "spot check" - however, we usually rely on co-operation and as a policy we always do it by appointment. If a crime is suspected or reason to believe in non-compliance with your certificate, we would arrive with a uniformed officer, who would exercise their powers of entry under the Firearms Act"

Mike
 
Exactly - and thank you Wrens Mews, Matt Perring etc.

To summarise: unless non-compliance with your FAC or crime is suspected, then NO power of entry to just carry out a 'spot check'.

Alles klar everyone?

Firsttimer, to answer the latter part of your post #31, if they don't have prior evidence or suspicion of non-compliance or crime then they or 'legal experts' can't magic it up after the event as support for an illegal entry. We have laws to prevent that - perverting the course of justice at common law is one possible charge that could be laid at their door - not to mention internal police discipline procedures.
 
Exactly - and thank you Wrens Mews, Matt Perring etc.

To summarise: unless non-compliance with your FAC or crime is suspected, then NO power of entry to just carry out a 'spot check'.

Alles klar everyone?

Firsttimer, to answer the latter part of your post #31, if they don't have prior evidence or suspicion of non-compliance or crime then they or 'legal experts' can't magic it up after the event as support for an illegal entry. We have laws to prevent that - perverting the course of justice at common law is one possible charge that could be laid at their door - not to mention internal police discipline procedures.

Orion, think you might need to get out into the big bad world and experience reality rather than hiding behind your 'theory' of the law. Having been involved with many QCs it is amazing how persuasive they can be and a situation where you think the position is clear and the law protects a party, they present such an argument that the Courts accept the position.

Refusal to allow a Police officer alone could be cited as 'reasonable cause to suspect' a crime is being or is about to be committed undert the FA 1968. I know of 2 instances where the situation in the OP occurred and because the wife or partner knew of the whereabouts of the keys for the cabinet, the firearms were confiscated from the FAC holder. Call it under hand tactics or good Policing it does happen with or without reasonable cause to suspect.

Further case where an altercation took place in a public house and 3 individuals set about a chap quite innocently, chap defended himself and hospitalised the offenders in self defence with witnesses. Following morning Police attended without Warrant and siezed guns from FAC home citing excessive force used and that the FAC holder should have called Police for assistance or let the c*ap be beaten out of him. Solicitor had no joy arguing case and firearms were removed for 3 yrs and haven't heard if the FAC got them back still. Where is the offence under the FAC or Firearms Act here?
 
"Refusal to allow a Police officer alone could be cited as 'reasonable cause to suspect' a crime is being or is about to be committed undert the FA 1968."

if this is the case I'm moving country!
 
"Refusal to allow a Police officer alone could be cited as 'reasonable cause to suspect' a crime is being or is about to be committed undert the FA 1968."

if this is the case I'm moving country!

Well in all my time as a police officer, if I tried that one with the custody officer or the CPS, I would have got my arse kicked. I think some people seem to think that police officers are totally anti shooting etc - I bet there more than a few that are members of this site.

It is yet again turning in to a thread of "I heard.............A friend of a mates dogs aunty"
 
Orion, think you might need to get out into the big bad world and experience reality rather than hiding behind your 'theory' of the law. Having been involved with many QCs it is amazing how persuasive they can be and a situation where you think the position is clear and the law protects a party, they present such an argument that the Courts accept the position.

As you don't know me or my previous experience at the sharp end of enforcing 'the law' - not hiding behind 'theory' as you quaintly put it, I'll treat your response as ignorance rather than anything else.

You're in some strange kind of parallel world if you believe that refusal to allow a police office to do anything to which he does not have a right in law would constitute reasonable cause to suspect anything.

What next - thought police? :rolleyes:
 
"Refusal to allow a Police officer alone could be cited as 'reasonable cause to suspect' a crime is being or is about to be committed undert the FA 1968."

if this is the case I'm moving country!

Relax PKL, this is about the worst piece of advice/opinion on this thread...
 
Well in all my time as a police officer, if I tried that one with the custody officer or the CPS, I would have got my arse kicked. I think some people seem to think that police officers are totally anti shooting etc - I bet there more than a few that are members of this site.

It is yet again turning in to a thread of "I heard.............A friend of a mates dogs aunty"

Agreed - I'v never read so much ill informed tosh !!!
 
I have a alcoholic raging thunder whore neighbour who like to do all kinds of weird stuff against us because 'we moved in'. She made a complaint a while back along the lines that I drove my car at her and her son one day. I'm really glad she doesn't know I'm a gun owner.
 
8x57 -
The police have no right of entry to private premises unless invited, with a warrant, or in immediate pursuit or when suspecting certain offences (usually indictable) are being committed.

Relax PKL, this is about the worst piece of advice/opinion on this thread...

Just to be clear- this was neither opinion nor advice as I was egging on my 'friend' Orion for a reaction with success. I had already stated that 'cold calling' is not reasonable excuse but my learned friend could not accept this and due to me highlighting with an extract from the FA68, errors in his post regarding Police Powers to enter, he had to have a dig at me to my amusement.

It is interesting to note that a couple of (past/serving?) Police Officers have commented that this would be contrary to their custody officer or CPS's liking, however, West Yorkshire Police (according to the OP) and others have tried it- see they have not commented on that matter !
 
Yes, it's a bit sad isn't it.

I'd say that 99.99% of those who frequent the forum on a regular basis are more than willing to give advice and opinion in an honest and forthright manner. Just goes to show that the exception proves the rule this time around.

Although I'm somewhat in the dark as to what he was 'egging' me on to prove or disprove? A statement was made regarding police having the ability to see evidence of wrongdoing merely because a citizen exercised their lawful right, and I and others responded. It looks to me that someone might be trying to remove egg from their own face - and failing.
 
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just make sure you know who is asking to see your guns if you do not know the pc or feo phone the police they should know that a 'spot check' is taking place
 
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