Can the SD have a voice in politics?

David63

Well-Known Member
On one of the other threads, forgive me I can’t remember which one, it was asked is the SD, now it has 10,000 members, would ever have a voice in politics.

We in my view yes it can.

Both BASC, and I think the CA have used forums in the past to get members on there to lobby, take part in polls, e-mail their MP , MeP, or prospective PCC and so on.

Forums are a great way of getting messages out to an audience, and as so many forums are discipline specific this is a great help.

For example, late on last year there were some very real direct threats to transporting airguns and their component parts in the post, through a couple of the airgun forums as well as e-mails to our airgun members, we managed to elicit a massive response to the royal mail consultation and the initial threat was averted.

Increasingly electronic media, including Twitter, Facebook and forums are becoming more and more important in lobbying.


Also with forums there are thousands of eyes and ears reading papers, web reports, listening to radio that can pick up shooting stories / issues and report them back to the organisations.


Admittedly many of the organisations will use press / media monitoring services to pick up the main stories, but never the less I know we would rather have 100 people tell us about the same story they have seen rather than 100 people assume we already know and not get in touch – remember some of the regional media for example will be missed off the monitoring services.

So in my view forums not only have a voice, they have a very important roll in keeping shooting safe.

David
 
I would think you are right David, but that would be based upon all the members supporting the one issue. So, as long as the issue doesn't involve calibre, vehicles, head shots, distance shots, english versus scots rules, makes of rifles, training requirements or (of course) shooting organisations, we should be a force to be recognised:D
 
About time Admin took this crap off of the site again David BASC is trying to use this site a a pawn in there game .

​This site if you have not noticed is about Deer Stalking
 
Surely campaigning against things that may prevent you stalking, should be posted here. Or are you one of the hunter/ shooters in this country who believe if you ignore it, then it wil go away. Believe it or not it will go away, of course I mean your sport not the issues.
 
About time Admin took this crap off of the site again David BASC is trying to use this site a a pawn in there game .

​This site if you have not noticed is about Deer Stalking

Talk about shooting the messenger WS!

Why is it there are people on here who just can't resist having a pop at David because of his employer?

I am afraid your comment don't represent my feelings on this post mate. I'm with Taff on this one.

Do you know under 100 people complained to the PCC about The Suns inaccurate front page spread on Assault Rifles for sale in the UK? I'm watching the Anti Aigun ban in Scotland petition struggle to achieve the kind of interest we got over the WH Smith censorship of shooting magazines and wondering how we expect to stop the constant erosion of shooting without all individually making a more positive contribution.

Meanwhile there are 10,000 people signed up to this site that one must assume are at least interested in shooting who could do something positively to protect our sport but cant be arsed to do anything but have a pop at those who would.

Theres a special name for people like that. Can't think of the word..... Anyone?
 
I think that we should take note of what David BASC has said. The internet is a powerful tool to rapidly disseminate information and gain support for our cause. You can be damn sure that the antis are already aware of this and doing so to gain support for theirs. atb Tim
 
There is a huge difference between registered membership and active members.
Having said that the internet is a powerful tool, just thinking back to WH Smith when they temporarily banned the sale of shooting magazines to the under 14's, that ban didn't last long!
Cheers
Richard
 
I think that we should take note of what David BASC has said. The internet is a powerful tool to rapidly disseminate information and gain support for our cause. You can be damn sure that the antis are already aware of this and doing so to gain support for theirs. atb Tim

+1 on that. And as for only 100 people complaining to the PCC about the Sun newspaper I don't believe that it was only 100 because locally I know of three shooters who complained plus myself. Keep up the pressure to maintain shooting and use every tool possible or we will soon be in a position like Holland.
 
On one of the other threads, forgive me I can’t remember which one, it was asked is the SD, now it has 10,000 members, would ever have a voice in politics.

We in my view yes it can.

Both BASC, and I think the CA have used forums in the past to get members on there to lobby, take part in polls, e-mail their MP , MeP, or prospective PCC and so on.

Forums are a great way of getting messages out to an audience, and as so many forums are discipline specific this is a great help.

For example, late on last year there were some very real direct threats to transporting airguns and their component parts in the post, through a couple of the airgun forums as well as e-mails to our airgun members, we managed to elicit a massive response to the royal mail consultation and the initial threat was averted.

Increasingly electronic media, including Twitter, Facebook and forums are becoming more and more important in lobbying.


Also with forums there are thousands of eyes and ears reading papers, web reports, listening to radio that can pick up shooting stories / issues and report them back to the organisations.


Admittedly many of the organisations will use press / media monitoring services to pick up the main stories, but never the less I know we would rather have 100 people tell us about the same story they have seen rather than 100 people assume we already know and not get in touch – remember some of the regional media for example will be missed off the monitoring services.

So in my view forums not only have a voice, they have a very important roll in keeping shooting safe.

David


David,

You come across as shrewd and intelligent in your posts, you defend Basc very well and when needed you do admit shortcomings. That's all very well and I admire that.
YOU MUST BE BONKERS THINKING THAT THIS SITE CAN HAVE SOME VOICE IN POLITICAL MATTERS
Sorry for the caps lock but i do hope you take my point.
I am sure i don't need to defend that statement. Yes some members here could sit down and discuss matters on shooting very well and i would suppose some will know all about laws and regulations, that's not just knowing what calibers are out there either or what google says or wikipedia for that matter.
You carry on as too does the bds and only take advice from your grass roots stalkers and shooters (those deemed as professionals if you wish) as you and all others have done for years.

off to bed now so i will see how this develops later
 
+1 on that. And as for only 100 people complaining to the PCC about the Sun newspaper I don't believe that it was only 100 because locally I know of three shooters who complained plus myself. Keep up the pressure to maintain shooting and use every tool possible or we will soon be in a position like Holland.

Then read the response you received to your complaint. Heres mine. http://www.pcc.org.uk/case/resolved.html?article=ODI1OA

I know about 25 of those came from Frome and District Pistol Clubs mailing list.

We need to get cohesive and get active. Bitching about BASC and expecting everybody else to pick up the load is getting us nowhere.
 
I have been called much worse than bonkers on this site – so no offence taken what so ever.

I am not talking about a rep from the SD being an appointed stalking lobbyist, but I am talking about members on here getting involved in e-mail campaigns for example.

I would be amazed if all active members let alone all 10,000 got involved, but this site does have a roll to play in getting information out on issues that may impact shooting or more specifically stalking, and giving guidance on what to do next.

But also forums like this are useful if getting grass roots feedback too, which is vitally important to any organisation.

Sincerely

David
 
David, You come across as shrewd and intelligent in your posts, you defend Basc very well and when needed you do admit shortcomings. That's all very well and I admire that. YOU MUST BE BONKERS THINKING THAT THIS SITE CAN HAVE SOME VOICE IN POLITICAL MATTERS Sorry for the caps lock but i do hope you take my point. I am sure i don't need to defend that statement. Yes some members here could sit down and discuss matters on shooting very well and i would suppose some will know all about laws and regulations, that's not just knowing what calibers are out there either or what google says or wikipedia for that matter. You carry on as too does the bds and only take advice from your grass roots stalkers and shooters (those deemed as professionals if you wish) as you and all others have done for years. off to bed now so i will see how this develops later
So if we whipped up 10,000 responses to the Scottish Airgun Consultation Document that would count for nothing in your eyes PSstalking?

Too late by the way if you haven't done anything. The petition finally clawed its way to 14000 signitures, about the same as the WH Smiths petition.

Remind me mate, how many shooters in the UK?
 
The site has already had an effect on politics regards deer stalking in Scotland and will continue to do so. It is watched and read by many who inevitably make the decisions. Were deer are concerned. The influences come from BASC BDS ADMG SGA FCS and others who sit at the Table with the Legislation makers SNH. The only way you will change this is by forcing the hand of the large organisations. They sit at the table and are your voice. If you feel that your Organisation of choice is none effective because of there nepotism towards the government departments then you will need to go to your MSP(Scotland ).
Remember the Deer Sector need you and with a strong voice you can make change.
 
When we purchased this site about 4 or 5 years ago we had 700 odd members, and at no point did I want the site involved with politics. We purchased the site to help other stalkers, to meet and make friends, and hopefully for the membership to grow and give good sound advice and help to fellow stalkers/deer managers.

We as in admin have been aware of other organisations taking a keen interest in the SD site as it has grown over the short years. I would like to think that we are all on the same side no matter what our differences of opinions are. However I woudl also add that the shooting community are an odd lot at times, so divided, yet so passionate about their sport, whether its driven pheasant, fox hunting or deer stalking.

What matters is that the years ahead will be difficult, and that we are seen to be all speaking with one voice. This is easy to say, not easy to achieve I know, but it is important that to see our sport, and I mean all country pursuits, for our children and our grandchildren to enjoy and have the chance to undertake that we do not appear to be divided.

As this site grows and more join our ranks we will hopefully be in a position to put our point of view across as one. I know some may disagree, and certainly I am not proposing that this site will be the be all and end all and will carry the day over matters that affect us all. But I would hope that as one we can at least be heard and taken notice off in the future.

As with most things in life Time will tell ;)
 
If you view the SD as a potential specialist interest lobby, then yes, it can definitely have political influence in this area. But you have to be realistic with your expectations. This is a website primarily concerned with just one very specific area (deerstalking) of a minority pursuit (shooting). This site has 10,000 members, most of which are probably FAC holders. On the latest statistics, that means that something like 7% of all FAC holders use this site. That’s pretty sizeable. If you look at participation, about 1% of thread viewers participate in the discussions. That sort of tallies with the number of reported complaints to the PCC mentioned before. Having done a fair bit of successful non-party political campaigning myself, that degree of active participation in anything whatsoever is pretty representative. It’s not bad actually.

Now here’s the thing. If you want to lobby an MP, local councillor or WH Smith on something related to deerstalking, and that’s all that SD members should aim to do with any sort of realistic clout, you’re vying for their attention along with the 1% of members of other groups who can be bothered to put pen to paper, finger to keyboard of face to constituency surgery. The numbers are really so small that on a specialist subject, you can genuinely hope to have an impact. The chances are, the person you’re speaking to won’t have given this matter much thought. They probably assume that no-one cares much either (and in the big scheme of things, that’s true, if you think that on the one hand an MP has people campaigning to keep a hospital open, and on the other some bloke going on about his hobby’s magazine in the newsagent’s). Until someone comes and explains their concerns succinctly and clearly, at which point it’s clear that there are votes at stake.

The key is clarity, consistency of the message, a dash of individual input to give your letter/email some colour and make it more memorable, and finally what you want the person you’re engaging to do about it. General statements of principle aren’t that helpful. They lack the “so what” factor. But an accumulation of this sort of lobbying over time leaves a lasting impression and a feeling with MPs etc. that here is an area that they need to pay attention to. This accumulated grassroots lobbying is particularly effective if done in conjunction with the type of engagement at a higher level that the BASC or the CA carry out.
 
I have been called much worse than bonkers on this site – so no offence taken what so ever.

I am not talking about a rep from the SD being an appointed stalking lobbyist, but I am talking about members on here getting involved in e-mail campaigns for example.

I would be amazed if all active members let alone all 10,000 got involved, but this site does have a roll to play in getting information out on issues that may impact shooting or more specifically stalking, and giving guidance on what to do next.

But also forums like this are useful if getting grass roots feedback too, which is vitally important to any organisation.

Sincerely

David
What's the odds on B.A.S.C. Trying it's own advice then???????? You do have that lovely "Media" building.
 
Yes BASC and the CA have growing e-mail data base and use e-mail newsletters to carry information to members all the time. I cant speak for the NGO or SGA as I am not am member so don’t get their newsletters, but I would be surprised if they did not have an e-mail communication strategy, their web sites are certainty kept up to date and informative in my view

But obviously not every shooter is a member of BASC, CA, NGO, SGA and so on – so other electronic media are very useful to get the message out to shooters.

Pine Martin is sport on, the coordinated effort of the organisations taking the lead, putting up good and useful information on their web sites on the issue and details of what members and indeed other shooters can do is the best way forward, and the WH Smith shooting magazine issue and Royal Mail consultation are prime examples of where this was used to great effect.

David
 
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