8X51 Mauser?

MARCBO

Well-Known Member
I once had this great idea to neck up the 308 to 8mm and discovered it had been (or rather the 8X57 shortened to 308 length) many years before. I still believe it has merit and am wondering if anyone has any experience with this cartridge?

SS
 
It has been done, of course. Here is a very detailed article by one such wildcatter.
http://thehunterslife.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13603

The .338-308 cartridge has more loadings out there, which will give you an iidea of what to expect.

But you are better off with an 8x57IS. More powder, better match of case size to bore volume, about 100 to 150 fps more speed with tons of known and proven recipes.
 
Bak when I first thought of doing this I was caught up with the moniker 8-08 for my version. I figure modern powders would allow me to come close to the 8x57 in perfomrnace and do it in a package that will run in a short action.

SS
 
Forgive my ignorance but what would an 8x51 do that a .338 Federal or .358W would not?

(Unless you just want something different then go for it!)
 
Nothing at this point but there are certainly a lot of other calibers that do not provide any advantage over others. Besides, when I first envisioned this there was no 338 Federal only the rarely heard of 8X51 Mauser....
 
Nothing at this point but there are certainly a lot of other calibers that do not provide any advantage over others. Besides, when I first envisioned this there was no 338 Federal only the rarely heard of 8X51 Mauser....

I see, well, let us know how you get on!
 
Just get a Browning BLR Takedown in .358 Win with an extra 7mm-08 barrel and you are set to travel and hunt.
The .358 Win is a hammer on big deer, bear, pigs, and a great woods good. Very accurate rifle, the BLR.

If you can't let go of the short 8mm notion. Get the BLR in .325 WSM.
 
I had a 358 WIN in a Ruger 77R about 30 years ago . It was okay but it never grew on me so to speak . I also had a pair of Marlin 336ER's in 356 WIN which are the same thing pretty much with a rimmed case and I actually liked them especially with home cast lead bullets .

I did the 338 Federal in a TC Encore and while I liked the cartridge quite a bit I am not a Encore person .

The 8mm-08 has intrested me for awhile now . As has the 8mm-06 , I've just never bothered to build either so far !

Nothing personal but I find the Browning BLR's a little clubby . Once upon a time I thought a pair of BLR's would be the perfect North American battery chambered in 270 WSM and 325 WSM . But after playing with a scoped BLR or two I quickly got over that idea .

I did however have a Winchester Model 70 synthetic rifle in 325 WSM that was a very nice shooter after I put a RifleBasix trigger in the gun . Seemed it liked the Nosler 180 BT quite a bit .

After having owned a pretty decent number of lever action rifles over the years I gotta say the Marlin 336/444/1895 action guns feel very nice in my hands . Whereas I cannot say the same thing for the Winchester 1894 , Savage 99 or the BLR .
 
I am a Marlin lever gun fan. It is neat to have a .22LR in 39A, a .336 full rifle in .30-30, a .444 with 24 inch barrel. Now I just need an 1894 in .357.

They are all easy to carry in the woods. So are the Savage 99 and BLR. The 99 with the round bottom really fits in the hand. And both of them are strong and accurate.

The 8mm-06 is a whole different ball of wax than an 8mm-308, or a .358 Win. It has the powder capacity to match the bore. I own five or more 8x57s, from 1888 to M48, plus sporters, and an 8x60S. A 195-gr to 200-gr bullet at 2,500 to 2,650 fps hits hard at 100 yards, and at 400 yards.

To me, the reason to build something like these, or buy one, is the rifle itself. You might find a WWII bring back, engraved 8x57, 8x60S, or a ream out job to 8mm-06, which can be bought right, refinished, reblued, and own a thing of beauty which would be unaffordable today.
 
I do like the look of a BLR. I sometimes wonder if a BLR in .358W or .338 Federal would be a good driven boar / woodland stalking rifle.

Fast handling and good bullet using a fair bit of mass. Quick second if you needed and with enough thump for boar and big deer but not going so fast as to smash up roe / munties... Hmmm... project...
 
I am a Marlin lever gun fan. It is neat to have a .22LR in 39A, a .336 full rifle in .30-30, a .444 with 24 inch barrel. Now I just need an 1894 in .357.

They are all easy to carry in the woods. So are the Savage 99 and BLR. The 99 with the round bottom really fits in the hand. And both of them are strong and accurate.

The 8mm-06 is a whole different ball of wax than an 8mm-308, or a .358 Win. It has the powder capacity to match the bore. I own five or more 8x57s, from 1888 to M48, plus sporters, and an 8x60S. A 195-gr to 200-gr bullet at 2,500 to 2,650 fps hits hard at 100 yards, and at 400 yards.

To me, the reason to build something like these, or buy one, is the rifle itself. You might find a WWII bring back, engraved 8x57, 8x60S, or a ream out job to 8mm-06, which can be bought right, refinished, reblued, and own a thing of beauty which would be unaffordable today.
. When I was at the apex of my Marlin affliction I had close to 100 of them and about 24-26 just in 444 . I have since gotten the Marlins down to a more manageable number of 12-14 . I am well aware of the difference between the 06 and 08 cases and their derivatives . As to building on old Mausers that is of no interest to me I prefer to build on pre 1990 Rem 700's . Your opinion and mine vary widely and I'll stick with my own as it's worked for me for over 50 years .
 
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I do like the look of a BLR. I sometimes wonder if a BLR in .358W or .338 Federal would be a good driven boar / woodland stalking rifle.

Fast handling and good bullet using a fair bit of mass. Quick second if you needed and with enough thump for boar and big deer but not going so fast as to smash up roe / munties... Hmmm... project...
I'd rather have a BAR then a BLR fir a driven gun but then semi autos are not legal in the UK correct ? I have. Friend in Italy that shoots a fair amount of driven stuff and he seems to be found of Marlin levers in 444 and 45-70 .
 
I can tell you first hand that the .358 Win in a BLR is a potent woods rifle for large boar, elk and moose. A friend of mine hunts with one and has taken all three. He lives in the mountains where I hunt boar of Bavarian stock, 120 years ago. Most are over 250 lbs and some large ones are over 400, standing about 42 inches at the shoulder. When hunting in the winter, with open views and shots up and down of 100 to 200 yards through the bare trees, I use a .30-06 with a scope. Trailing and stalking in river bottoms and swamps, or ambushing moving boar, I use the .444 Marlin
 
6pt-sika,

I agree on the older Remington 700s. I still have my first one from the 1960s, a .30-06 ADL which shoots better every year. I don't build on them, though I have in the past. I just keep my eyes open for a nice, clean, babied ADL, BDL Classic or Custom Shop C Grade.

I am not building off of old Mausers. I am restoring any nice firearm which is not ruined, but just finish worn, whether it is an AH Fox, Parker, Winchester 1873, or engraved Mauser with integral ribbed barrel. Even better, I just like to find one in pristine condition from the original family, and keep it for someone who really appreciates it as it is. Last year, it was a 1950 Mannlicher Schoenauer, an 1893 Marlin in .44-40, a Winchester in .38-40, all 98% condition, a sporting Mauser in 8x60S, and a WWII 1903A3 sniper rifle with scope. Some move on to friends. I run a halfway house for hunting tools which I don't want to see buggered up.
 
an 1893 Marlin in .44-40

FWIW , Marlin NEVER chambered the Model 1893 for 44-40 , they only chambered that model rifle for the 25-36 Marlin , 30-30 , 32-40 , 32 Special and 38-55 . However they DID chamber the Marlin Model 1894 for the 44-40 cartridge as well as the 25-20 , 32-20 and 38-40 .
 
I have had several people tell me that about the 1893, but I have have had a few Marlin collectors who know more than I examine the rifle and shake their heads. I got it from the original family. It is pristine. It may be an 1894, that just looks more like an 1893. I need to take it apart sometime and photograph all the stampings on the receiver and barrel. I all I did was take it apart for a thorough cleaning.

I also have a Model 39A Deluxe, which was never cataloged. I have a 39 Deluxe, which was. My 39A I bought from the son of a Marlin salesman, and it was a Deluxe 39A built for him. The salesman's sample rifles in 336 and 39A were nice.

That is how guns are: a few uncatalogued things out there, especially during transitions, short model life, The Depression. I once had a Model 70 Super Grade from the Custom Shop, in .308 Win... never cataloged.

I just buy Marlins I like, and hunt with them. Bolt actions and military rifles, I know much better. Some of those were built in batches of 5 or 10 of a variant in the early days, some semiautos and machineguns, only one of a kind.
 
When I attended gunsmithing school in the mid 1970's I rechambered a number of Mausers to 8-06. The school owned the reamer and surplus mausers were still cheap in several of the local pawn shops. I suspect that rechambering was one of the most commonly work done on rifles for the school's "customers". I shot each one of them before returning them to their owners but the caliber just never struck my fancy.

SS
 
The 8x60S and 8mm-06 don't give that much more performance over the 8x57IS. The 8x60S is a work around laws intended to disarm civilians, and the 8mm-06 was an economic modification to use plentiful K98 Mausers and .30-06 brass. Today, there are so many good 190, 200 and 208 grain bullets in .308, and a bear or moose hit with a 200-grainer from an 8x57, 8x60S, 8mm-06 or .30-06 cannot tell the difference. Complete penetration is complete penetration.
 
The 8x60S and 8mm-06 don't give that much more performance over the 8x57IS. The 8x60S is a work around laws intended to disarm civilians, and the 8mm-06 was an economic modification to use plentiful K98 Mausers and .30-06 brass. Today, there are so many good 190, 200 and 208 grain bullets in .308, and a bear or moose hit with a 200-grainer from an 8x57, 8x60S, 8mm-06 or .30-06 cannot tell the difference. Complete penetration is complete penetration.


Yup. AB
 
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