300 AAC or 300 Whisper

MARCBO

Well-Known Member
Has anyone tired either for Roe deer. I am not impressed with the volocities and not inclined to purchase one. Could be an option for my 11 y/o son but he is doing well enough with a 308 W.

SS
 
Has anyone tired either for Roe deer. I am not impressed with the volocities and not inclined to purchase one. Could be an option for my 11 y/o son but he is doing well enough with a 308 W.

SS
I know two guys who hunt with them and I have done extensive range work with a custom Savage in this chambering. Most recently with a Remington 700 which has given nothing but headaches with any bullet or speed. I'm not certain that even the lightest/fastest load is deer legal in the UK but i could be wrong.~Muir
 
I've not messed with a Whisper or Blackout however I have wathced several others fooling with them at the range . Frankly I see no reason for the cartridge unless you wanna shoot subsonic with a suppressor . And to be totally honest if one wants to do that it isn't that difficult to get a 308 doing the same thing . I've fooled with no less then 4 rifles in 308 WIN that were threaded for suppressors . And with subsonic handloads they were all capable of MOA at 100 yards .

So bottom line is they can both shoot subsonic well if one puts forth the effort , however with the Whisper/Blackout you are kinda stuck there or with a slightly faster full tilt load . With a 308 your choice of options is ALOT more varied . I don't ever see a Whisper/Blackout in my future but a 700 HB in 308 threaded for a suppressor is a much better possibility .
 
I've not messed with a Whisper or Blackout however I have wathced several others fooling with them at the range . Frankly I see no reason for the cartridge unless you wanna shoot subsonic with a suppressor . And to be totally honest if one wants to do that it isn't that difficult to get a 308 doing the same thing . I've fooled with no less then 4 rifles in 308 WIN that were threaded for suppressors . And with subsonic handloads they were all capable of MOA at 100 yards .

So bottom line is they can both shoot subsonic well if one puts forth the effort , however with the Whisper/Blackout you are kinda stuck there or with a slightly faster full tilt load . With a 308 your choice of options is ALOT more varied . I don't ever see a Whisper/Blackout in my future but a 700 HB in 308 threaded for a suppressor is a much better possibility .

What weight bullets were you shooting subsonic in the 308? And what were the twist rates?
The Whisper and Blackout will function in ARs. It is a small and efficient case that will deliver subsonic loads with a full case of powder which is something that would be difficult with a 308 shooting the same bullets at subsonic speeds. If you're shooting a 308 at Sub Sonic Speeds you are achieving the same results as the Whisper but in a much less efficient case. I mean, it seems that way to me.~Muir

PS: I like the round and am considering having my CZ Varmint 204 rebarreled to that cartridge with a 1-7.5" twist.
 
As has already been stated, the Whisper was designed for subsonic loads run through a semi-auto rifle (AR specifically).

Generally speaking the barrels are a 1-7ish twist, lobbing 220-240gr bullets.

That being said, many hunters on the southern east coast use the Whisper/AAC for the smaller whitetail deer (~85lbs average, dressed), mainly because they are hunting in dense brush and want something (even at supersonic levels) that has a fairly low report. Some also use the cartridge in a single shot pistol for hunting.

As stated, a very efficient cartridge, that shines in an AR, but limited in range when run subsonically.

JMTCW...

Edit: As an aside, long barrels with subsonic loads can be VERY bag sensitive. Enough to make you pull your hair out until you realize it.
 
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I thought the whole point of the 300Whisper was to chuck subsonic lead? (and therefore slowly)
clue is in the name surely?

Remington's factory AAC load is (I believe) a 115 grain at 2400 fps but you're right, the intent was to shoot hi-rev heavy bullets. I used to shoot 220 grain cast @ 1040 fps.~Muir
 
I was looking for more flexibility than just being able to "chuck subsonic lead". I can do that with a 45-70 and have significantly greater terminal performance at 100yds.

SS
 
I was looking for more flexibility than just being able to "chuck subsonic lead". I can do that with a 45-70 and have significantly greater terminal performance at 100yds.

SS

Probably. But the 30 Whisper -like the 338 Lapua- is a specialty cartridge designed for one one purpose and now being adapted to other uses. From the very start you've voiced a dislike for the 300AAC as well as the disinclination to own one. Makes me wonder why you even brought it up. Have you ever shot one? They are an interesting study in ballistics.~Muir
 
A friend built one for suburban deer hunting on a 65 acre patch between two areas with some housing. Just put a barrel on his Thompson single shot. We worked up loads of 200, 220 and 240-gr at about 980 fps. They all killed deer in their tracks at 25 to 65 yards, but no expansion, of course. Very accurate and you could not hear it from much distance with the trees and underbrush.

I think it would be easy same sort of loads in one of my .308s and a .30-06 using Trail Boss, SR-4759, or 5744. It might not get down to subsonic.
 
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A friend built one for suburban deer hunting on a 65 acre patch between two areas with some housing. Just put a barrel on his Thompson single shot. We worked up loads of 200, 220 and 240-gr at about 980 fps. They all killed deer in their tracks at 25 to 65 yards, but no expansion, of course. Very accurate and you could not hear it from much distance with the trees and underbrush.

I think it would be easy same sort of loads in one of my .308s and a .30-06 using Trail Boss, SR-4759, or 5744. It might not get down to subsonic.

The issue with a stock 308 is stability. If you're going to use a heavy hitter (long and heavy) at subsonic speeds you need the tight twist of the 300W/AAC. I made up 30-06 loads over the years using cast bullets trying to achieve good accuracy at sub sonic speeds and ended up with noticeable yaw at distances which varied slightly with the gun. All were 1-10" twist and accuracy was seldom commendable. The closest i got was 1210 fps with an RCBS 165 grain bullet. Shot MOA to 100 yards from a Winchester Model 70A.~Muir
 
What weight bullets were you shooting subsonic in the 308? And what were the twist rates?
The Whisper and Blackout will function in ARs. It is a small and efficient case that will deliver subsonic loads with a full case of powder which is something that would be difficult with a 308 shooting the same bullets at subsonic speeds. If you're shooting a 308 at Sub Sonic Speeds you are achieving the same results as the Whisper but in a much less efficient case. I mean, it seems that way to me.~Muir

PS: I like the round and am considering having my CZ Varmint 204 rebarreled to that cartridge with a 1-7.5" twist.

I used 200-220 grain jackted bullets in the four 308's I worked with . Even tried some 220 grain cast bullets . I believe the twist was 1-10 in all four rifles (two 700's , a Howa and a Savage Hog Hunter).

My whole point is with the 308 you have a far greater spectrum of uses for the gun . Sun Sonic on up to norm and possibly more . Now with that being said I'm not a 308 person as such but I'd certainly rather have a 308 then the Whisper/Blackout .

Should one want's to use the 308 at normal velocities etc all they need do it change the handload . You damn sure can't do that with a Whisper .

So a 308 can be a Whisper but a Whisper can never be a 308 !

I worked up initial loads with the Sierra 220 RN bullet and later used Outlaw State 220 grainers .

http://www.outlawstatebullets.com/2.html

14.5 grains of Trailboss with the Outlaw State 220 grain bullet clocked 950-975 in all 4 rifles at the muzzle . To be dead on at 100 yards one needed to be 2 inches high at 25 yards , 3 1/2 inches high at 50 yards , 3 inches high at 75 yards to be dead on at 100 !
 
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I shoot 300aac Blackout, subsonic (980fps) indoor 25m loads are 3.2gr of N310 and a cast 115gr "soup can" boolit, very, very accurate, and very cheap to load :)

For outdoor range (100m and upwards) I use a Nosler 168gr Custom Competition over 16.8gr of H110 which gives just over 2000fps, again a very accurate load.

I also shoot 308 subsonic indoors at 25m, 115gr round nose cast boolit over 4.7gr of N310 gives around 950fps.
 
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From the very start you've voiced a dislike for the 300AAC as well as the disinclination to own one. Makes me wonder why you even brought it up. ~Muir

Doesn't mean I am not willing to listen to positive arguements and have my mind changed. Some people refer to me as being knowledgeable but I take umbrage should they use the word expert!

SS
 
Doesn't mean I am not willing to listen to positive arguements and have my mind changed. Some people refer to me as being knowledgeable but I take umbrage should they use the word expert!

SS

Fair enough. It just sounded like you were a bit jaundiced towards it to begin with. It's more of a plaything to me: easy to form brass, eats very little powder, and very accurate. Like a super sized 22 Sub Sonic Load. :D ~Muir
 
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