Humane dispatch calibre?

flytie

Well-Known Member
I recieved a call early on this afternoon, a deer trapped in a fence, "will you come and shoot it please"? Now as it happens, I was out with the 6.5x55 already so I drove straight there.

It was a fallow yearling and a more unprepossessing animal I have never seen. Not only had it got itself trapped but it had a huge partially healed scrape on its back. It was in a double fence about 1.5m wide with small hedge plants. The poor wee thing had got in and could not get out, got stuck and ripped the lower part of its right rear leg off. It had nearly torn the bottom part of its left near fore-leg off too.

I just used the 6.5, the ground was soft, so a quick dispatch ensued.

But what would be the best thing to use if/when called out again? Would a .22rf be a better choice, or even a .410, what would you recommend?

Any help gratefully recieved :!:

ft

spelling edit, sorry :oops:
 
Hi Flytie

I use my 458 Lott with 300gn flat nose soft pints. I have downloaded the cartridge to 45-70 levels so its just deer legal in terms of energy. The advantage is the rifle is short barrelled and on ironsights acts like a shotgun with less ricochet risk than slug. With a scope its zero at 25-100m.
I have used my moderated stalking rifle in the past and found it a bit unbalanced and slow to pick up the target on if a wounded deer suddenly breaks cover.

Mark
 
MarkH said:
Hi Flytie

I use my 458 Lott with 300gn flat nose soft pints. I have downloaded the cartridge to 45-70 levels so its just deer legal in terms of energy. The advantage is the rifle is short barrelled and on ironsights acts like a shotgun with less ricochet risk than slug. With a scope its zero at 25-100m.
I have used my moderated stalking rifle in the past and found it a bit unbalanced and slow to pick up the target on if a wounded deer suddenly breaks cover.

Mark

Mark, I can just imagine the look on his face if I asked my FEO for a .458 Lott for "humane dispatch", it's almost worth doing ;) And while I agree that a 45/70 or similar (your downloaded Lott) would more than do the job, I was wondering given a variety of circumstances, what would be the best option?

It could be a road collision, so on a hard surface. On stony ground, so riccochets could happen.

It is just playing on my mind, as I have done three in two years, all of which were in fields. Who knows about the next one, it could be anywhere and I wondered what other like minded folks were using?

ft

edit;
http://www.thedeerinitiative.co.uk/pdf/guide_culling_vehicleCollisions10-9-08 published.pdf
http://www.bestpracticeguides.org.uk/culling_humaneDispatch.aspx#logo
and,
http://www.bestpracticeguides.org.uk/culling_humaneDispatch02.aspx
 
bieng a cheapskate i always wondered about putting in 4 a 410 humane despatch pistol with the veiw of buying a 50 quid folding 410 and cutting it down to use as a pistol could either use nomal cartridge for hard ground and close range or a single slug if it was necessary to stand back a bit,not sure of the legalities of changing a shotgun to a firearm though but i am sure the firearms would be much more amicable in issuing a single shot 410 than a full bore pistol
 
mickjgardner said:
bieng a cheapskate i always wondered about putting in 4 a 410 humane despatch pistol with the veiw of buying a 50 quid folding 410 and cutting it down to use as a pistol could either use nomal cartridge for hard ground and close range or a single slug if it was necessary to stand back a bit,not sure of the legalities of changing a shotgun to a firearm though but i am sure the firearms would be much more amicable in issuing a single shot 410 than a full bore pistol

Mick, I know hunt servants and slaughtermen can apply for a cut down .410. I have just applied for a variation to my FAC and seen that they are mentioned on the blurb available. Would they grant me one for the limited amount of dispatches i do? Not sure. Although i am being asked to do more and more.

It is surprising how many people have now asked me about this service since I did this one near a local village. It seemed to involve most of the parish council ringing round everyone they could think of to come and dispatch a severely injured fallow follower. I have got some more stalking from this too, so it was well worth doing.

I am still unsure about what is best, I like the idea of a folding .410. Cheap, easy to carry and hide in the vehicle. Mmmmmmm! Probably safer than a .22rf sub-sonic too.

You have got me thinking.

Atb, ft
 
thing is if you get it cut down to pistol lenght it would be easier to handle if you have to crawl into bushes etc plus you would be legally able to buy single slugs which you cannot on a shotgun certificate,they are more than cpable of dipatching a deer of any size,thousands of pigs were dispatched with them years back when there was a countrywide pig disease
 
At close range a .410 is near perfect for any size of deer. It's about the only use mine gets these days as it's child size and waiting for the next generation of Moles to learn with it!
 
So, the general concensus is a .410 is the tool.

I do not know about the cut down version Mick :confused: I am not sure if the FEO would wear it. Not sure about slugs either, but they would be damned effective at close-ish range.

Many thanks, ft
 
if you did not want to go the section 5 route there is still nothing stopping you from cutting the barrels down to 24",folded it would then be quite compact
 
i hav a pistol and a 30-30 (specified just for this purpose) aswell as a 5 shot semi-auto all at the ready just incase, but the shottie is the one i reach for most,especialy for roadside or gardens
if i'm out ,what ever i hav with me at the time always does the job ;)
and that normaly is the one that counts :p
 
I've shot a few wounded deer with a 12bore and used various cartridges from AAA's to 8's, depedning on what situation they've been in.
AAA's for a wounded Fallow Buck someone managed to heard into a fenced plantation and was shot at around 30 metres away and 8's for when they been hit by a car and are laying on a grass verge and shot from 2 metres away.

I'm not on any RTC call out lists but some of my firends who are take a 12b with a few 6's and AAA's, and a centrefire rifle, which will cover most eventualities.

A pistol could be a good idea as it is easy to conceal , and can be used for dispatch where space is limited.

When I was a local knackerman I used a bolt gun for most animals, and a .38 pistol for Horses and larger cows. Sometimes when an animal escpaed from local slaughterhouse they were shot with a .243 or .270, the most memorable incident was a bull that escaped and went onto a small island in middle of a shallow river. A 270 to the shoulder dropped it and a back up shot to the back of the head 15 seconds later with a .38. Only downside was the river had steep banks so we had to get a teleporter to come and retrieve it.
 
In England for humane dispatch a rifle must be of legal calibre and suitable ammunition, for the type of deer,
any shotgun may be used but only if the animal is so seriously injured that to do so is a act of mercy, a knife may also be used
but a charge of unnecessary suffering may be brought by a clumsy or inexpert attempt.
In Scotland any weapon or method may be used but again a charge can be brought for an inappropriate method or inexpert operation.
 
As a matter of interest as an add on to this thread who carries a pistol for humane dispatch purposes
Personally I always carry a down loaded round for the calibre of whatever rifle I am using for this purpose just in case and is clearly marked as such with red felt tip over the full cartridge so no error of chambering the wrong round, saves all that extra weight.
 
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Many years ago I worked in a slaughterhouse where a 410 was always kept and used on bulls, since then I have finished off several cattle using the old folding 410. One word of caution, never put the barrel directly against the animals head, hold it an inch or so away. Common sense I know, but I have seen the result, not good for the weapon!
 
In England for humane dispatch a rifle must be of legal calibre and suitable ammunition, for the type of deer...

I am not sure that that is 100% correct. I believe that any rifle (an ammunition) to hand may be used as "necessity knows no law".
 
Here is the definitive answer on the use of Firearms to dispatch deer from Deer: Law and Liabilities...

England and Wales:

Deer Act 1991 (amended 2007)

6 (4) A person shall not be guilty of an offence under section 4 (1) or (2) (using prohibited methods or firearms) when using any reasonable means for the purposes of killing any deer if he reasonably believes that the deer has been so seriously injured, otherwise than by his own unlawful act, or is in such condition, that to kill it is an act of mercy.

'any reasonable means' means any method of killing a deer that can reasonably be expected to result in rapid loss of consciousness and death and which is appropriate in all the circumstance (including in particular what the deer is doing, it's size, its distance from the closest position safely attainable by the person attempting to kill the deer and its position in relation to vegetative cover.)
Scotland:

The Deer (Firearms etc.) (Scotland) Order, 1985)

A person shall not be guilty of an offence against this Act or any order made under it in respect of any act done for the purpose of preventing suffering by an injured r diseased deer; or a deer calf, fawn or kid deprived, or about to b deprived, of its mother.

The effect of this exemption in relation to the use of firearms, is that any firearm of any description can be used in the circumstances of a mercy killing without contravening the law relating to deer.
Northern Ireland:

The Wildlife (Northern Ireland) Order, 1985

A person shall not be guilty of an offence under article 19(3)(a) (prohibited firearms and ammunition) by reason of the killing of any deer by using any smooth-bore gun, if he shows that the deer had been so seriously injured, otherwise than by his unlawful act, or was in such a condition, that to kill it was an act of mercy.

Schedule 11 of the Act specifically prohibits the use of handguns.
So you can use any firearm (with the exception of handguns in NI) if you can reasonably expect that it will cause rapid unconsciousness and death and that it is appropriate to the circumstances.

Note: this is also subject to the conditions on your firearms certificate for the firearms in question.

Alex
 
Sorry about that guys I did not realise that the law had been amended in 2007, as I never shoot in England have and not kept abreast of the changes there.

My quote: was taken from a publication of deer laws dated 2004 [ oops must learn to keep my big mouth shut]
 
Not sure about slugs either, but they would be damned effective at close-ish range.

I'm not sure about the slugs either. Having shot things a few feet away with 7s in a .410, I think the shot would probably behave like a slug within a couple of yards of the muzzle.
An advantage of shot over slug might be a much reduced ricochet risk, quite apart from the relatively cheaper and non-restricted cartridges.
 
I'm not sure about the slugs either. Having shot things a few feet away with 7s in a .410, I think the shot would probably behave like a slug within a couple of yards of the muzzle.
An advantage of shot over slug might be a much reduced ricochet risk, quite apart from the relatively cheaper and non-restricted cartridges.

Dalua, you are absolutely correct, it does perform in a sluglike manner at close range. I keep reading about people using .410 slugs for foxing, but had never considered them for humane dispatch. I do not think i will be using them, but I am going to buy a .410, I have got one on loan and have an option to purchase,

ft
 
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