Bi-Pods used with free floated barrels & bedded barrels

Brithunter

Well-Known Member
Would like your opinions and experiences with Bi-Pod use. Recently I tried using a Harris non swivel 9-13" Bi-Pod on a Parker-Hale 1200C that has the normal factory bedding so the barrel is not free floated and it simply will not shoot with any sort of precision off the Bi-Pod. I tried it again yesterday off the bench at the range and with the Bi-Pod fitted and three shots spread over 6" wide :eek: yet remove the Bi-Pod and use a bag rest it produces a three shot group of under 1". I am not yet convinced that this rifle does not have a basic bedding problem as I am certain it should produce tighter grouping than this :confused: however the difference is rather dramatic.

Meanwhile I have tried the same Bi-Pod on another rifle that does have a free floated barrel and it shoots with similar precision to when just rested on a bag. I have to check carefully the difference in POI when it's shot in different positions. Off the Bi-Pod, off a bag rest and off the stick.

Later to further this experiment I will also try the Bi-Pod on another Parker-Hale rifle this time an 1100 Lwt in .308 which shows excellent grouping off a bag but as yet it's never been tried off the Bi-Pod partly because the Licensing people in their wisdom saw fit to list it as collection only and not for shooting :confused: and refused to swop it with another rifle that is listed for shooting :eek: why I have no idea.
 
Brit, my finnbear when first aquired, had a bridge in the wooden stock around half wave of the barrel, & with a bipod I could'nt get any sort of accuracy at all, I think it may have been due to leaning into the aim a little, thereby twisting the stock, after having it free floated & recrowned, In the words of Muir "Bugholes!" even with the bipod on.:D
 
Finnbear did you just free float the barrel or did you have the action bedded as well, just interested to know as i have a 691 that has the bridge as well,its pretty good as it is but was toying with idea of free floating it but was unsure as to wether i'd have to bed or not.
Cheers Neil
Should have said i don't use a bipod only sticks.
 
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Always better to get the action properly bedded as some free float jobs stress the action and old bedding. Anyway, for all it costs it takes one more variable out of the equation. And your rifle is more likely to behave itself in different temperatures and humidity. Free float, bed and recrown (if appropriate) can make a huge difference to a rifle.
 
Thanks Finnbear and Mauser,the stock is a lovely bit of solid old walnut and it groups around the inch mark anyway perhaps i should leave it well alone don't really want to go digging it out for bedding if i can help it ,i'll see how the wood behaves in the summer before i go doing anything drastic.
Cheers Neil
 
Hmmm that is sort of what I was expecting. My trouble is that I don't like the look of floated barrels and except for this particular 25-06 they all shot well with a non floated barrel but then I never used Bi-Pods before really. The 6.5x55 that shoots well off the Bi-Pod is a sporterised Swedish Mauser and had a sort of floated barrel when I brought it. I say sort of because as I recall it touched in places (mind you this was quite a fews back now) so I floated the barrel by relieving the high spots. I had just re-done this as I noticed when checking with the Moderator fitted that the barrel was touching. The weight of the moderator was making it touch a bit of fine sandpaper wraped around a socket sorted that out. Perhaps I will keep one ort wo rifles just for use with a Bi-Pod and forget their use with the others.
 
i dont have a problem with a free floating barrel and bi pod but i have had,you really have to make sure you are not putting any weight on the rifle or twisting it in your shoulder.the twisting problem is even easier to do with a non swivel bi pod because if the legs arent adjusted spot on you do tend to compensate by twisting to line up crosshairs.changed to a swivel bi pod for this reason and also because adjusting legs on the bonnet of a vehicle while shooting foxes meant that the fox was gone by the time i was sorted
 
For me a hunting rifle must be free floating. It must also have so much room between barrel and stock that I can run an oily rag through. Mainly to remove all the crud and water. Another point, the gap must be proportional to the stiffnes of the stock, meaning a cheap tupperware stock will have to have quite a big gap to avoid touching in all hunting situations. A stiff composite stock that is bedded can get away with way less gap.
One of the worst situations I come across is lying steep downhill prone, shooting across a valley off a high bipod. All sorts of stress are on the stock then.
I could almost guarantee that my rifles will shoot to exactly the same point off bipod, bag, tree or sticks.
edi
 
Thank you for your comments. All my rifles have wood stocks. As I said I will check this one out hopefully tomorrow and see how we get on perhaps at a later date I will see about a swivel version of the Bi-Pod.
 
Bipods take practice. Heavier the recoil -especially in a springy item like the Harris- the harder it is to make it group. I hate them for heavy rifles and prefer kneeling or prone.~Muir
 
I have also found that bipods with lightish barelled rifles also do funny things. I think bipods work well with heavy barrels and moderators etc with plenty of weight to settle them down.
 
Ok I think I had better post these photos as this is the 6.5x55 that I am currently using with the Bi-pod as it shoots well from it:-

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The thread protector that I have had laying around for years is the same diameter as the muzzle of the P-H 1200C and as you can see the 6.5mm's barrel is heavier. It's the Std military profile and so is stepped with each step being parrallel and not tapered. I have to use a different Delrin bush with this rifle to that used on the 25-06. Barrel length on the 6.5mm is 22"

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With the moderator, sling Bi-Pod and scope it weighs 11lbs :(.

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I thought about using lower scope rings then remembered that I never got around to changing the safety lever and so it has the std Mauser Military safety still. A project for later is to fit the low safety or perhaps change the trigger to an adjustable one with a side safety.

Of course the 6.5x55 is not known for it's heavy recoil being regarded as mild in the recoil department :p.
 
Ok here's the answer. With the bipod on you should still positivly support the forend with your left hand rather than leave the bipod to bounce. This is not a bedding issue.
Whenever you want to improve accuracy always go to a sandbag as this will usually half the grouping size.

Mark
 
Shooting of a bipod should make no difference to the point of aim, if you find there is then its either a rifle fault or shooting style
fIrst a floating barrel wil always be more accurate than a fixed barrel a barrel vibrates like a tuning fork when a rifle is fired a fixed barrel stops this vibration so makes it less accurate, as has already been said some cheap stocks can flex causing the barrel to touch the stock when fired again stopping the barrel vibration, some cheap synthetic stocks will flex in hot weather, also wooden stocks swell an contract with different humidity, so need to make sure that barrel is always free, quick check run a crisp bank note between stock and barrel it should slide free without any tight spots, have the action glass bedded, a lot of makers are now using alloy bedding blocks alloy is also subject to temprature change, go for glass.

THis is probably teaching my granny to suck eggs, but one of the most common problems with a bipod is the rifleman holding on to the front of the stock this will often bring the barrel in conntact with stock when a bipod is used, the left hand is not need when using a bipod , use it to support your right arm or under the trigger guard what ever you prefer but never on the forend of the stock.
 
Sorry Mark but I can't agree with that, holding the forend with a bipod and a free floating barrel tends to bring the barrell in contact with the stock, and yes the rifle will bounce depending on the calibre yes you will have lost your sight picture but the bullet has left the barrel by the time the rifle bounces, doesn't matter what you shoot from the rifle still bounces you only notice it more from a bipod.
 
Shooting of a bipod should make no difference to the point of aim, if you find there is then its either a rifle fault or shooting style
fIrst a floating barrel wil always be more accurate than a fixed barrel a barrel vibrates like a tuning fork when a rifle is fired a fixed barrel stops this vibration so makes it less accurate, as has already been said some cheap stocks can flex causing the barrel to touch the stock when fired again stopping the barrel vibration, some cheap synthetic stocks will flex in hot weather, also wooden stocks swell an contract with different humidity, so need to make sure that barrel is always free, quick check run a crisp bank note between stock and barrel it should slide free without any tight spots, have the action glass bedded, a lot of makers are now using alloy bedding blocks alloy is also subject to temprature change, go for glass.

THis is probably teaching my granny to suck eggs, but one of the most common problems with a bipod is the rifleman holding on to the front of the stock this will often bring the barrel in conntact with stock when a bipod is used, the left hand is not need when using a bipod , use it to support your right arm or under the trigger guard what ever you prefer but never on the forend of the stock.

Hmmm I'll admit that my technique with a Bi-Pod is probably incorrect and I will try your method of using it however the bit about bedded verses floated barrels is obviously wrong :rolleyes: I wonder what experience your basing this on?

Now this 6.5mm rifle has a floated barrel and although it's quite accurate it has never given the kind of precision that produces three shots making one ragged hole as do two rifles with bedded barrels ;) Now I submit this photo as an example of how rifles can show likes and dislikes in ammunition:-

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The top three shots ringed that are spread are a load I tried years ago using a Speer 200 grain bullet and the rifle really didn't like it. The bottom group is three shots of the Hornady 130 Gr SP bullet loaded over a charge of BLC-2 :cool: the rifle is a Parker-Hale 1100 Lwt in .308 and at the time it had a little Nikko Sterling Special 4x32 scope with Picket Post and hair reticle range was 82 yards (75M) and it was shot off an old coin bag filled with sand as a rest from prone.

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Now this three shot group was shot using the same bullet but this time in arifle chambered for the 30-30 Winchester cartridge and was shot on Bisleys Short Sibera range at 100 yards:-

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Again this rifle has a tightly bedded barrel with no gaps at the sides so no chance of getting any paper down between the barrel and walnut of the forestock :cool:. This 30-30 cannot be used with a Bi-Pod as the front sling attachment is a barrel band the P-H 1100 Lwt has Q/D studs as a factory fitment and does have the front on in the slim schnable forestock although I have not tried shooting it off a Bi-Pod and until the Police put it on the to shoot list I cannot do so right now. This trail was conducted just after acquiring it before they entered it onto my certificate.

Now this is practical experience not theory and from this small sample says that a properly bedded barrel can shoot as well if not better than a free floated barrel :cool:.
 
Sorry Mark but I can't agree with that, holding the forend with a bipod and a free floating barrel tends to bring the barrell in contact with the stock, and yes the rifle will bounce depending on the calibre yes you will have lost your sight picture but the bullet has left the barrel by the time the rifle bounces, doesn't matter what you shoot from the rifle still bounces you only notice it more from a bipod.

If you are shooting a light recoiling rifle such as a 243 or it has a moderator, muzzle break or heavy barrel I would agree with you. If you are hanging off the fore-end so hard that you can get the barrel to touch the fore-end I am afraid to say your free floating set is is very poor.
The physics of shooting will show the rifle recoiling backward the moment the bullet leaves the cartridge not the barrel so the rifle will rotate upwards and backwards before the bullet leaves the barrel.The majority of recoil stops when the moment the bullet has left the barrel.A sanddag will absorb much of this energy whereas a bipod on a hard surface will not. With unmoderated lightweight sporting rifles in medium caliber gently holding the foreend will help 100%. Try not holding the foreend of a 375 H+H when shooting off a bipod and you will soon see your groupings change. You can just support the stock with a sniper set-up due to its very heavy barrel and a 50 cal BMG has a huge muzzle break - we are not snipers.
 
OK I said that a floating barrel will always be more accurate than a fixed barrel, that was a broad statment and not always correct it depends on the stock to barrel fit, if an exact barrel to stock fit with no high or low spots in the fit then should
be Ok, I would add that not that many rifles are that well built, however in a hunting rifle this is not very important as any problem should only show up when the barrel gets hot, groups getting wider as the barrel heats up, this is why nearly all target shooters have floating barrels a floating barrel should always have the same P.O.I.

The general rule is if you have a fixed barrel and it shoots good groups leave it alone, if its not grouping well then float the barrel and you will see an improvment

Heavy barrels seem to cause less trouble in a fixed system than light barrels, with lighter barrels some upward pressure on the barrel at the tip of the fore-end seems to dampen vibration in away that can improve accuracy.

The science. as a barrel heats up unless your stock material has the same heating characteristics and expansion rate as the barrel it is going to move differently to the barrel causing a change in P.O.I.
 
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