Unannounced police visits to legal gun owners

Sorry feller's just tried it if you get the bunny up then up click on the news tab top left. just worked for me :tiphat:
 
Sorry feller's just tried it if you get the bunny up then up click on the news tab top left. just worked for me :tiphat:

Yep that worked.
ive nothing to hide but a bit worried about erosion of my rights. I'd have no problem if the police phoned me in advance and arranged a mutually convenient time to come visiting. Obviously if they had some reason to suspect that I was up to no good then fair enough (but I'm pretty sure that will never be the case)!
 
I have read the article with interest and my major query is

" does the limited power of entry (the police DO NOT have an automatic statutory right of entry) apply to FLO's who are not warranted police officers"

I think they cannot but could be proved incorrect.

I think its worth reminding all family members that they do not have access or know how to gain access to your firearm storage facilities should you not be present if a visit is made.
 
As far as i can see No they still have no new powers on entry but bet it could be seen as you are hiding somthing if you shut the door on them !!! after all we are the bad guys ???
 
What does BASC say? Can't ask them as I can't get the link to work so can't frame the question properly.

David.
 
Yep that worked.
ive nothing to hide but a bit worried about erosion of my rights. I'd have no problem if the police phoned me in advance and arranged a mutually convenient time to come visiting. Obviously if they had some reason to suspect that I was up to no good then fair enough (but I'm pretty sure that will never be the case)!

+1
 
Thats the one feller. One would have hoped BASC would have a view ! but it would seem that the word is head down and let the police come in like schoolboys infront of the head master !! my Q would be how has the REAL Bad guys got my info ?????? :-|
 
This could backfire badly.

If you know your local FEO and he makes an appointment you can be reasonably sure that the caller is genuine.

However, if persons unknown to you turn up at random purporting to be police officers you must be aware that they might be criminals attempting to illegally acquire firearms.

If any police call here that I don't recognize I shall lock them out and call 999, better safe than sorry!

atb Tim
 
good advice
and if they stay on the step they are real bobby's


This could backfire badly.

If you know your local FEO and he makes an appointment you can be reasonably sure that the caller is genuine.

However, if persons unknown to you turn up at random purporting to be police officers you must be aware that they might be criminals attempting to illegally acquire firearms.

If any police call here that I don't recognize I shall lock them out and call 999, better safe than sorry!

atb Tim
 
I have no problem letting a policeman in if he has a reason
question is.....what is the reason?

"spot check"? do one. not legal, not required, not authorised, not covered in any aspect of Home Office guidance on security (which is there only concern)
"come round for a chat"? - no problem officer..."tea or coffee?" but you wont be seeing my guns or cabinet without a warrant or a fecking good reason (see above)
 
not to happy with it, with having a wife that hates guns etc,

what this going to do to her if we are sat eating our eveing meal at the table with the kids ? and plod pops in,

have a read,


Police concern that members of the shooting community may be “vulnerable to criminal or terrorist groups” has prompted the Home Office to update its firearms guidance to support forces in England and Wales in their intention to start making unannounced home visits to legitimate gun owners.
The policy, which is effective from today, has been introduced ostensibly to ensure certificate holders are complying with firearms security measures — this is despite the fact that the Home Office’s own figures show that theft of guns is not a widespread concern. On average, in the past five years, annually just 0.025 per cent of the 1,837,243 legally held firearms and shotguns in England and Wales were stolen — an average of just 475 guns per year. The figures are not broken down to indicate whether a firearm was stolen from a home, military or commercial environment or whether it was stolen in transit. Despite such low figures and little evidence of a genuine problem, a dedicated Crimestoppers hotline has also been launched “to encourage members of the shooting community and the general public to report any concerns about legally held firearms”. BASC called the hotline “unnecessary and inappropriate”.
Chief Constable Andy Marsh, the national policing lead for firearms and explosives licensing, called on the shooting community to lend its support to the new measures, saying: “The public and especially the shooting community can greatly assist the police in gathering intelligence and protecting our communities by being vigilant around firearms licensing. The shooting community is close, and will recognise sudden behavioural changes in fellow shooters that could cause concerns. However, they may not feel like they can act and the Crimestoppers hotline empowers people to voice concerns anonymously.”
He added: “If you are concerned that guns are being kept insecurely or notice signs that shooters may be vulnerable to criminal or terrorist groups or have shown sympathy towards extremist acts, please report it.”
The new Home Office guidance states: “Where it is judged necessary, based on specific intelligence in light of a particular threat, or risk of harm, the police may undertake an unannounced home visit to check the security of a certificate holder’s firearms and shotguns. It is not expected that the police will undertake an unannounced home visit at an unsocial hour unless there is a justified and specific requirement to do so on the grounds of crime prevention or public safety concerns, and the police judge that this action is both justified and proportionate.”
Importantly, shooters must understand that no new power of entry has been conferred on the police or police staff, and those undertaking a visit must provide “a clear and reasoned explanation” for doing so.
In launching the measure, Chief Constable Marsh stressed that the police’s intention is not to “catch out gun owners”. He said: “I know that the vast majority of gun owners understand their responsibility to secure firearms and in the main take this very seriously, which allows their continued lawful use for work or leisure purposes.”
BASC’s Richard Ali stated that the association backs the police in their efforts to help firearms certificate holders “maintain the excellent record of safety and security in England and Wales”. He added: “Where there is specific intelligence of threat, risk or harm then the police should act.”


This latest move follows on from the introduction last year of Operation Solitaire, a community engagement project which is, according to the police, “aimed at reducing the vulnerability of those with legitimate access to firearms, to using these weapons illegally.” The operation’s target audience includes people who have “regular interaction with holders of firearms and shotgun certificates”.
Police firearms enquiry officers and neighbourhood officers have visited shooting clubs and registered firearms dealers in recent months to highlight concerns surrounding the potential for terrorists or mass killers to exist within the shooting community.
One gun club member recently wrote in an online forum for armed services personnel that his personal experience of the Operation Solitaire initiative was: “the crappiest attempt by the plod at getting us to grass each other up as lone wolf killers”.
[h=2]BASC’s advice on home visits:[/h]The BASC is advising members to ensure their security arrangements are up to standard. The association is reminding shooters that the police are required to provide a clear and reasoned explanation to certificate holders at the time of an unannounced visit. Shooters should be left in no doubt as to why the visit is being made. The association has reiterated that the police DO NOT have an automatic statutory right of entry, but BASC recommends a sensible and co-operative approach to this type of situation.
BASC states: “It is possible that the reason for visiting may not be specifically about the certificate holder but may relate to other factors such as local rural or urban crime. There is an expectation of elementary co-operation from certificate holders following a reasonable request to check the security of your firearms.”
If shooters feel that any visit has not been undertaken properly, they should first draw this to the attention of the local force, clearly stating the reasons why they believe this to be the case. BASC has also stated that it will challenge robustly any police force which does not correctly follow the Home Office guidelines.

Read more at Unannounced police visits to legal gun owners begin
 
The new Home Office guidance states: “Where it is judged necessary, based on specific intelligence in light of a particular threat, or risk of harm, the police may undertake an unannounced home visit to check the security of a certificate holder’s firearms and shotguns. It is not expected that the police will undertake an unannounced home visit at an unsocial hour unless there is a justified and specific requirement to do so on the grounds of crime prevention or public safety concerns, and the police judge that this action is both justified and proportionate.”

I can't see anything to suggest any change in the current law. If being vulnerable to terrorists/terrorism is a credible reason to come and check my firearms and firearm security then so be it but they still have to explain what grounds they have for this if entering uninvited.
If this is gaining media interest it does worry me though. The amount of police forces that seem to write their own rule book when it comes to firearm ownership I just hope it does not happen with this.
 
My main concern is that anti shooters will abuse the system. Obviously nothing has changed legally, it's just that by creating a dedicated phone line and all the publicity they are pretty much inviting people to grass up shooters for anything they can think of!
 
My main concern is that anti shooters will abuse the system. Obviously nothing has changed legally, it's just that by creating a dedicated phone line and all the publicity they are pretty much inviting people to grass up shooters for anything they can think of!

this is such a true statement.

I cannot go into details (names and location) as its only jungle drums at this time, but i have heard from a shooting buddy up north that i chap from south yorkshire is undertaking a case with a solicitor against a neighbour all because of this other section on domestic violence,(being blackmailed in some way by this neighbour because he has a firearm ?)

there sure seems to be a lot of changes taking place and little information being given to the certificate holders, ............ not a good sign of things to come. and its a good job a few on this site spend time finding these things out.

bob.
 
The police don't have the time, money or resources to carry out spot checks for no reason or would they be inclined to do so. This is purely a way to respond to some Intel or a concern when there is insufficient evidence for a warrant or to use existing powers.

The important thing in my mind to remember about our rights is to know when to exercise them. Some people like "exercising their rights" for no other reason than they can which generally makes things harder for the rest of us and ends up with more law and legislation brought in to overcome certain rights.
 
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