Police Sctoland stopping condition 'o'

Mungo

Well-Known Member
A word of warning to Scottish folks:

after a conversation with Fettes yesterday, it seems that they have been told by the Home Office that they can no longer grant condition 'o' on an FAC.

This is the condition that authorises you to obtain a new rifle on the condition that you dispose of an existing one. It is the useful condition that allows you to hang onto (and continue to use) a rifle up to the point where you can sell it and immediately replace it.

The lady I spoke to agreed that this was going to be extremely inconvenient for a lot of people, and indicated that there was going to be a meeting about it shortly.

However, anyone who has a currently active application for this type variation iis likely to be waiting a very long time. Best get them to send you back your ticket and go the normal route (sell the gun and apply for straightforward 1-for-1).
 
I didn't know there was such a thing.
Seems a retrograde step to me. With the pressure on licencing staff it seems to me that they need all the streamlining they can get, and so do we.
I have a right hand rifle but would like to turn it into a left hand,no calibre or model change,that's it. I'd also want to keep using it right up until the swap.
Have to wait and see what happens.
Thanks for the info.
 
I didn't know there was such a thing.
Seems a retrograde step to me. With the pressure on licencing staff it seems to me that they need all the streamlining they can get, and so do we.
I have a right hand rifle but would like to turn it into a left hand,no calibre or model change,that's it. I'd also want to keep using it right up until the swap.
Have to wait and see what happens.
Thanks for the info.

AKA the Grampian condition. I did this very recently exchanging one 17HMR for another. Historically available here in Scotland because of often large distances to travel from home to RFDs I think? I have two and a half hour journey each way (recent landslips allowing). That's a lot of Diesel!
 
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I have a right hand rifle but would like to turn it into a left hand,no calibre or model change,that's it. I'd also want to keep using it right up until the swap.

Yup - condition 'o' would have been perfect in this instance.

I think everyone (both the Police and us) would ultimately be happier if there was a system which allowed for 1-for-1s without the need for a variation at all. It would substantially cut down their workload and would make our lives a whole lot easier.
 
Since when has common sense applied at the home office , some bureaucratic tird will have noticed or more likely told by another tird at acpo about this sensible arrangement and immediately sprang into action to ban it .

Grrrr :old:
 
just had my variation 1:1 back from fettes,,,9 weeks and incorrect...sent back and hping to have back by xmas
 
also unaware that existed
not surprised they are binning it though, too much like freedom of choice there!

just get an additional rifle added before you sell
two rifles in the same calibre has never been an issue
might cost you £26 in the long run but thats about 1/3 of a tank of petrol to sell one, get a 141, go back and buy another rifle!
 
Recently had a 3 off - 3 on variation from Grampian , some were conditional on disposal of the 3 going off , made life much easier . I suppose that's it , it was too simple and easy !
 
just had my variation 1:1 back from fettes,,,9 weeks and incorrect...sent back and hping to have back by xmas

I'm doomed.

What is their problem? The rest of Scotland never seems to have these issues.

Makes me wonder - if only you could request to have your file handled by a different force - like moving to a different GP. Wouldn't that be nice...
 
Was discussing this only last weekend. A friend had sold his rifle and then acquired another of the same calibre. He submitted all the relevant paperwork only to receive a phone call informing him that he was now the proud owner of an illegally held firearm.
Now, surely if you have a filled slot for a rifle of "x" calibre and you dispose of it by whatever means, then it stands that you would now have an empty slot for another rifle of that calibre?
He was told that he had to re apply for a variation to receive the same calibre again.
I don't understand.
 
Was discussing this only last weekend. A friend had sold his rifle and then acquired another of the same calibre. He submitted all the relevant paperwork only to receive a phone call informing him that he was now the proud owner of an illegally held firearm.
Now, surely if you have a filled slot for a rifle of "x" calibre and you dispose of it by whatever means, then it stands that you would now have an empty slot for another rifle of that calibre?
He was told that he had to re apply for a variation to receive the same calibre again.
I don't understand.

It has always been the case that you need to apply for a variation to be allowed to acquire a new firearm after disposing of one - this is the standard 1-for-1. The slot does not 'stay open' once you've sold one - you need to apply to have it 're-opened'. I'm very surprised that anyone sold him one in that situation. Certainly an RFD should have refused the sale.

Hence condition O being so useful, since it effectively opens up the slot in advance of selling a gun.
 
Have never 1 for 1'd myself so hadn't come across the situation. I think it may have been the same for him.
I'm sure it was a private transaction. It all seems a bit unnecessary. I fear I would've fallen into the same trap myself had the situation arisen.
Every day's a school day though.
Thanks for that. The usefulness of forums comes to the fore again.
 
So, you must sell first, THEN apply for the slot again and wait until this permission comes through or am I missing something else?
If this is the case, is it quite a quick process? I only have the one slot so would be without in the interim.
 
So, you must sell first, THEN apply for the slot again and wait until this permission comes through or am I missing something else?
If this is the case, is it quite a quick process? I only have the one slot so would be without in the interim.

All the posts so far have come from Scotland .... and I've never heard of Condition 0 (zero?). There must have been an informal practice operating over the border which is now being brought into line with UK law, which is that if you dispose of one rifle you have to get a Variation for its' replacement. You can apply for a Section V permit for the old one (pending part-exchange through an RFD) but these permits are pre-printed to prohibit use (i.e. firing) and don't cover ammo. I've had a couple of these over the years when I had to travel up North to buy brand new rifles of the same calibre & trade in the old with York Guns.
 
I have never had an issue with a 141 variation but I struggle to see why it takes more than a couple of days
constant reminder and escalation becoming a royal pain in the ass is usually a good way of getting what you want!
 
It has always been the case that you need to apply for a variation to be allowed to acquire a new firearm after disposing of one - this is the standard 1-for-1. The slot does not 'stay open' once you've sold one - you need to apply to have it 're-opened'. I'm very surprised that anyone sold him one in that situation. Certainly an RFD should have refused the sale.

Hence condition O being so useful, since it effectively opens up the slot in advance of selling a gun.

Spot on
 
I have never had an issue with a 141 variation but I struggle to see why it takes more than a couple of days
constant reminder and escalation becoming a royal pain in the ass is usually a good way of getting what you want!

It shouldn't take any longer than it takes to type in the new details and print out the new cert. In any other sphere of life, 20 minutes would be regarded unacceptably slow!
 
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