open condition

Fireman sam

Well-Known Member
My firearms certificate is up for its first renewal soon and I would like It to be 'open' or 'less restrictive' is this something I have to ask for or is it given automatically?
If I need to ask for it to be 'open' can anyone give me advise on the wording of the letter.

Thanks
 
If your renewal is for exactly the same ticket as the original then you should get open this time without asking. If you have had variations recently for something bigger than the original then maybe not? As Archer says, your FEO should be able to advise.
 
Baguio is correct, without a doubt. The less restrictive condition should be applied automatically upon renewal, unless there have been any adverse issues.
If you apply for a more powerful calibre eg centrefire in addition to rimfire, then the less restrictive condition should be applied to the calibre already possessed with the more restrictive condition to the larger or more powerful calibre. Each case judged on the merits of course.
 
Can depend on the amount of use you have made of your ticket in these frst five years.Measured by the amount of ammo you have used and also how much land you have to shoot, to demonstrate varied experience. :tiphat:
 
Can depend on the amount of use you have made of your ticket in these frst five years.Measured by the amount of ammo you have used and also how much land you have to shoot, to demonstrate varied experience. :tiphat:

Sorry, but 'ammo you have used' or 'land you have to shoot' have no bearing on 'demonstrating' any kind of experience.

You can shoot thousands of rounds into a single 1m square earth backstop on a 20,000 hectare estate and it will prove what?
 
Sorry, but 'ammo you have used' or 'land you have to shoot' have no bearing on 'demonstrating' any kind of experience.

You can shoot thousands of rounds into a single 1m square earth backstop on a 20,000 hectare estate and it will prove what?

But the fact is some FAD's do take the amount of ammunition you have on your licence into account. mine certainly did.

So whilst buying lots of ammunition is no proof of experience, I'd suggest that it will give a better impression that buying very little !
 
Have a quick chat with your FEO, that's what he's there for

Is he now?

Firearms... Enquiry... Officer...

Oh!.... Yes!.... I see... you think that means his job is to answer "enquiries" put to him by license holders and prospective license holders.... and here's me thinking that his actual job was to make the enquiries required, in observation of a licensing authority's legal obligations, in order to satisfy themselves that applicants are "fit and proper" people with "good reason" to possess firearms, prior said Firearms Licensing Office issuing the certificates, which they are obliged to issue if the applicant is a "fit and proper" person with "good reason" to possess.

Darn it!... silly me.:rolleyes:

If it was me... and I know this is just a crazeee notion... but... if it was me, I would ask for what I wanted, providing good reason, and filling it all out on the form (F.101) and then just let them get on with doing the job I thought they got paid to do. I've actually always found this approach to work well. Mibbee I've just been lucky, of course. :D
 
But the fact is some FAD's do take the amount of ammunition you have on your licence into account. mine certainly did.

So whilst buying lots of ammunition is no proof of experience, I'd suggest that it will give a better impression that buying very little !

As I understood it there is no legal obligation to have ammo written on your ticket, I notice that some gunshops do and some don't.

Anyone else noticed this? Is that correct?

ATB
Moses
 
Is he now?

Firearms... Enquiry... Officer...

Oh!.... Yes!.... I see... you think that means his job is to answer "enquiries" put to him by license holders and prospective license holders.... and here's me thinking that his actual job was to make the enquiries required, in observation of a licensing authority's legal obligations, in order to satisfy themselves that applicants are "fit and proper" people with "good reason" to possess firearms, prior said Firearms Licensing Office issuing the certificates, which they are obliged to issue if the applicant is a "fit and proper" person with "good reason" to possess.

Darn it!... silly me.:rolleyes:

If it was me... and I know this is just a crazeee notion... but... if it was me, I would ask for what I wanted, providing good reason, and filling it all out on the form (F.101) and then just let them get on with doing the job I thought they got paid to do. I've actually always found this approach to work well. Mibbee I've just been lucky, of course. :D


Well then I am truly blessed, because both the Kent FEOs I have dealt with have been excellent and answered all my enquiries.
 
I recently had this issue (change of force, FAC changed to closed). I replied letter asking for my certificate to be opened based on:

* enough experience 12+ years, DSC1 etc.

* the fact that one of my permissions is in Scotland. Scottish forces don't clear land, leaving it up to the individual to decide. Thus having shooting north of the border is a reasonable reason to ask for an open certificate as a necessity.

I have also heard that a reference (stalking mate or friendly acredited witness) may help? Also I found a search on this site for "closed" provided so useful info?
 
Well then I am truly blessed, because both the Kent FEOs I have dealt with have been excellent and answered all my enquiries.

Oh, I have no doubt they did.

But... Did they actually answer correctly? ... Or only with their "interpretation" of correctly?

And...

Did you allow them to "talk" you into something other than exactly that which you had initially wished for?

If the answers to the above questions are YES, NO and NO respectively... then.... you truly were blessed, as there is a well reported tendancy for many/most licensing authorities to take full advantage of ignorance shown to them, to restrict and/or withhold that which is reasonably wished for... from an unwary, uninformed, applicant.
 
Oh, I have no doubt they did.

But... Did they actually answer correctly? ... Or only with their "interpretation" of correctly?

And...

Did you allow them to "talk" you into something other than exactly that which you had initially wished for?

If the answers to the above questions are YES, NO and NO respectively... then.... you truly were blessed, as there is a well reported tendancy for many/most licensing authorities to take full advantage of ignorance shown to them, to restrict and/or withhold that which is reasonably wished for... from an unwary, uninformed, applicant.

They were from different areas of Kent and

Yes
No
No

The caveat to answer 3 was clearance for land.
The land had been refused to another shooter and I was told in advance "Good Luck with ****. You'll need it"
**** came and said "No way"
So I invited him to look at what I proposed (One location for shooting and from a high seat)
He walked around the spot and explained why he was refusing my request, but ,as we drove back he told me to stop the car.
He got out, looked at a small area, said do x y and z and this spot will be ok.:)

Obviously I can only offer advice on how I have been treated ,but for me Kent Police are outstanding.
 
As I understood it there is no legal obligation to have ammo written on your ticket, I notice that some gunshops do and some don't.

Anyone else noticed this? Is that correct?

ATB
Moses


Either way, surely the answer is simple, just get them to list it. I was told the amount of ammunition I'd bought, backed up the information in my letters (mine, & from people vouching for me) requesting an open ticket.
 
They were from different areas of Kent and

Yes
No
No

Well that's interesting... but if you truly know that they answered correctly, why did you have to ask them anything the first place?

Or were you just testing them?

It's just that it strikes me that, in the normal course of events, an applicant who is inclined to ask questions of an FEO does not know the answers and therefore cannot know if the information they recieve is entirely correct or that it is not neccessary for them to "alter" a correctly completed application or accept unfair and unreasonable conditions, as many are talked into accepting.
 
Sam,
Dont pesume that your ticket will be automatically opened on the next renewal, IME you dont get what you dont ask for'
Add an accompanying letter explaining your experience in handling firearms, your ability to understand the need to recognise safe shots, your ability to indentify good backstops, public rights of way, encrouching housing, boundaries and general countryside etiquette.
Tell then that you believe you have gained enough knowledge over the term of your last licence to be competant at recognising all of the above, all of this will help.

Ian.
 
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