RTA call out, is your constabulary taking part?

cookingfat

Well-Known Member
The BDS is running RTA call out courses up and down the country so it would seem,

don't get me wrong I think its a good idea for those who have not done it and may wont to get involved,

From what I know from my part of the world, Hampshire, Wiltshire, constabulary's have teams of experienced stalkers who have open tickets and there own insurance + cover from the police insurance who there call on to dispatch animals that are involved in accidents.


My question to all those people doing this RTA course outside those constabulary's who have a scheme is, is your constabulary going to start a scheme? do there own people do it at present? or don't they care?
 
humberside has decided not to partake in the scheme although one of the officers has been trying hard to get it up and running only for the head not to want to go through with it, Although i have been called out before now, atb wayne
 
humberside has decided not to partake in the scheme although one of the officers has been trying hard to get it up and running only for the head not to want to go through with it, Although i have been called out before now, atb wayne

I think there may come a time in the not too distant future when the Police handle these things themselves. Whilst some forces have embraced the concept of 'stalkers dealing with RTA's, there are others who have not - and probably never will.

There are some concerns that if the Police call somebody out then the responsibility if something goes wrong lies with the Police. Are they prepared to take that risk??? ... In the longer term I think not. I reckon that deer RTA's involving the police will eventually be dealt with by the police. After all, each force has its own firearms teams who already deal with Cattle and Horses that need to be shot at a roadside. So why not deer????

I dare say that, some forces have already sussed out that many (not all) people who attend these RTA courses, do so in the hope of being able to get a pistol/handgun on their FAC's for the purpose. My prediction is that when the Police/Home Office see a steady increase in the number of applications for pistols/handguns, there will be some questions asked as to why the Police ARV's can't deal with deer at RTA's.

I'm interested in what others feel.

Regards,

Mike

Mike Allison
Managing Director - Jelen Deer Services
 
humberside has decided not to partake in the scheme although one of the officers has been trying hard to get it up and running only for the head not to want to go through with it, Although i have been called out before now, atb wayne
Wayne, Humberside do work with the Lincs deer group in north lincs. I expect the reason they don't call out stalkers on the north bank is the lack of any organising body to coordinate it etc.
As for Mikes point about using ARVs instead, I am not sure how many ARVs each force would typically have but if the area has a well-run, coordinated and subscribed scheme (like we have in Lincolnshire) I think in most cases a trained stalker can attend an RTA in a rural area quicker than an ARV(which let’s face it has more important things to be ready to react to than a deer collision and should probably spending the majority of its time in the more densely populated areas ready to sort out the bad guys or shoot a pit-bull!).
I agree with Mikes point about people using it as a reason to try and get a pistol could be seen as a negative for the police and lead to them being reluctant to support such initiatives. Cannot really see why you need one for RTA’s anyway.
 
Bart i understand that humberside do use lincs but trying to get something set up this side robin is not doing it, just in my area alone in a few weeks were over 10 RTA incidents that i know of. costs for ARV'S to attend are huge for each man that will soon eat away the budgets.
Mike I agree that some want pistols and see this as a way to gain but if you are not dealing with them then it isn't a good reason
Bart how would one set up something in this area as surely you dont come this side for RTA, ps I contacted lincs group but never got any info back from them,atb wayne
 
Hi Wayne
No your right LDG don't respond over your side of the humber that I know of and from my experience all the collisions i have responded to have been very local to me in north lincs (certainly got there quicker than an ARV from Hull, s****horpe or wherever could have done). I think from a welfare point of view schemes like this are fantastic and more areas could do with them. I cannot see ARV spending much time or having the right experience/inclination to find deer that are not obligingly laid at the side of the road (2 and half hours the other night!)
As for setting one up I would not have a clue were you start as I am just a responder. I think the fact that this is just one facet of what the LDG do in the county gives it more credibility with the authorities than a well-meaning individual/group of stalkers offering their services would have. I am surprised that you heard nothing back from the LDG as I have always had quick responses from them, so maybe give then another try for some advice. There was a couple of guys from up your neck of the woods on the LDG rtc course earlier on in the year. Good luck with what you are trying to do.
 
Thanks for the responce i will try again and see where i get ,I know the two lads that came over to do the course on your side, atb wayne
 
I dare say that, some forces have already sussed out that many (not all) people who attend these RTA courses, do so in the hope of being able to get a pistol/handgun on their FAC's for the purpose. My prediction is that when the Police/Home Office see a steady increase in the number of applications for pistols/handguns, there will be some questions asked as to why the Police ARV's can't deal with deer at RTA's.

I'm interested in what others feel.

Regards,

Mike

Mike Allison
Managing Director - Jelen Deer Services
[/QUOTE]
cos they dont know what to do when they get there
 
One thing I do know is that if Chris Howard is involved in taking the course, he will tell you that a hand gun is the last firearm you will need for the job.
so all thouse taking the course in the hope that they will get a hand gun think again, there there only a few cases where a hand gun is appropriate for dispatch.
 
I think there may come a time in the not too distant future when the Police handle these things themselves. Whilst some forces have embraced the concept of 'stalkers dealing with RTA's, there are others who have not - and probably never will.

There are some concerns that if the Police call somebody out then the responsibility if something goes wrong lies with the Police. Are they prepared to take that risk??? ... In the longer term I think not. I reckon that deer RTA's involving the police will eventually be dealt with by the police. After all, each force has its own firearms teams who already deal with Cattle and Horses that need to be shot at a roadside. So why not deer????

I dare say that, some forces have already sussed out that many (not all) people who attend these RTA courses, do so in the hope of being able to get a pistol/handgun on their FAC's for the purpose. My prediction is that when the Police/Home Office see a steady increase in the number of applications for pistols/handguns, there will be some questions asked as to why the Police ARV's can't deal with deer at RTA's.

I'm interested in what others feel.

Regards,

Mike

Mike Allison
Managing Director - Jelen Deer Services

In my view the police have little or no idea of how to deal with incidents where livestock / wildlife are loose or have been injured and need to be destroyed. One only has to look at posts on here where the police had to have three attempts at shooting the deer. The same goes for loose livestock, the police seem only capable of winding them up.

Dealing with deer strikes requires experience. The police simply do not have this.

As to people using this to acquire handguns, I have been told that the most effective hand gun for RTA dispatch is a .410 pistol. Not very exciting.
 
In my view the police have little or no idea of how to deal with incidents where livestock / wildlife are loose or have been injured and need to be destroyed. One only has to look at posts on here where the police had to have three attempts at shooting the deer. The same goes for loose livestock, the police seem only capable of winding them up.

Dealing with deer strikes requires experience. The police simply do not have this.

As to people using this to acquire handguns, I have been told that the most effective hand gun for RTA dispatch is a .410 pistol. Not very exciting.

Whether they know what they are doing or not, it doesn't alter the fact that they may not wish to take the responsibility of a non-police person getting it wrong!! ... And THAT is where it will fall apart in the future - Just my opinion.

Regards,

Mike.

Mike Allison
Managing Director - Jelen Deer Services
 
it will all end up being about liability vs cost of insurance vs cost of using their own officers to attend.
Different areas and budget priorities may end up at different conclusions....

As for what tools for the job then surely you'd assemble a suitable 'toolkit' ready in a grab bag to pull from your most easily accessed cabinet.
Likely to contain a 12g or a folder .410, a cut down silenced .22lr rifle, a big long sharp knife and possibly a pistol of some variety...
 
it will all end up being about liability vs cost of insurance vs cost of using their own officers to attend.
Different areas and budget priorities may end up at different conclusions....

... AND the public perception. The Police are very aware that they need to keep public opinion on their side, so are they prepared to take the risk of being shown in a bad light as someone they engage gets it wrong. Lets face it, its not only the Police that sometimes get it wrong ... Is it??

Regards,

Mike.
 
I don't think the undermanned police forces have the man power to attend every RTA involving deer especially in the rural areas which probably one of the reasons why they have a volunteer schemes in some constabulary's.


Tony
 
Mereside .Humberside police have had numerous chances to set up a network of Stalkers/keepers with insurance to carry out humane dispach but for some reason the hierarchy want ARU's to do it.
From what I've seen they are wrongly equipped untrained in it to say the least as are most forces.
Hampshire seem more enlightened.:eek:
 
Roedeered,
the BDS Wessex branch worked with Wiltshire and Hampshire police to set up a very good RTA call out system with experienced members and insurance cover from the police and the members own cover, the sticking point with both constabularies in the beginning was the insurance cover from the police.
both BDS and jelen's courses can only make you more aware of what to expect.
good luck
Tony
 
Tony you make a good point about using a pistol for dispatch, I was called out for the first time a cool weeks ago, I took a shotgun, it was 2000 muntjac with a broken back, his front half was very mobile, I wouldn't have fancied using a pistol and the PM was surprisedh quickly I got there.
 
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