6.5 Swede vs Creed?

[wildfowler.250]

Folks, what is the real life difference between these two calibers if you home load? I’m asking purely from an academic point of view as I realise they will be very similar.

6.5x55 has larger case capacity. Can it outperform the 6.5CM if home loaded? Would you have to load the Swede very ‘hot’ just to keep up with a standard 6.5CM round?

Does the 6.5CM use a faster burning powder than the Swede so it does better in a smaller case?


My main curiosity is that I picked out a Swede for the old man and I’ve used it occasionally. Effective caliber although I was surprised how much the trajectory changed over 200 yards compared to my .270. That being said, if I was buying new now, the creedmoor does seem like the sensible choice.


As a side note, which is your favourite 6.5 bullet? Our Swede seems to shoot 140 grain bullets better than 120. Currently using 143 eldx, very accurate but quite a lot of bruising!

 

[cjm1066]

Short v Long action.

Swede chambered for heavier bullets, so you can't seat lighter bullets close to the lands.

Credmore probably has tighter tolerances on chamber dimensions.

Get the rifle you like best.

 

[Mungo]

As far as I can tell, the differences are so marginal that it comes down to the specific powder-bullet-barrel length combination you use.

People get strangely worked up about this question. As a friend once said, ‘the debates in academia are so intense because the stakes are so low’, and I think that probably holds here!

 

[wildfowler.250]

Short v Long action.

Swede chambered for heavier bullets, so you can't seat lighter bullets close to the lands.

Credmore probably has tighter tolerances on chamber dimensions.

Get the rifle you like best.

Hadn’t thought about the lighter bullets / lands. I’ve never understood the obsession about a short action,(I read somewhere faster reloading time but that must be milliseconds).

Picked him up a s/h 75 at the time and you can’t really go wrong with that build quality for the money.

As far as I can tell, the differences are so marginal that it comes down to the specific powder-bullet-barrel length combination you use.

People get strangely worked up about this question. As a friend once said, ‘the debates in academia are so intense because the stakes are so low’, and I think that probably holds here!

Fair point and hadn’t even thought about barrel length. Totally agree academic, a deer wouldn’t notice the difference at normal ranges. Just curious whether the Swede could be ‘better’ with the larger case but I assume very little in it.

 

[cjs66]

Mine is a Swede and with 120g Nosler Bt and H4350 @ 2800fps. I have the same bullet in 140g too but the 120g does it all. Roe, Fallow and Reds. I’ve used 140g SST too, dropped deer very well but as you say, CAN cause a bit of bruising.

cjs

 

[tackb]

ignore the rifle and cartridge , start only with the projectile because whether it is a 6.5x47 or a 260rem or a 6.5x55 or the mighty creedmoor the same projectile is doing the same thing at the same velocity broadly speaking , buy the rifle you like unless you don't reload when really it has to be creedmoor for ammo availability

i have tried them all and now have two creedmoors , i reload but do like being able to buy super accurate ammo over the counter when i feel lazy or i'm up against it time wise

there are those that will tell you that the 260 for example is faster than the creedmoor , their handloads might be 50-100 fps faster but at what pressure because 'it looks ok' isn't really actually 'ok' , and if used for stalking will the deer notice that extra velocity............

 

[Utectok]

I think the swede can be loaded, in modern guns, to run a little faster than the CM (100fps?) Something I enjoy in mine (handy for long range targets but not really relevant for deer?) And the best bullet Bar none is the 6.5 tlr from yew tree. Really little difference although I hear to run a CM you have a man bun and to run a swede you have a beard so…..?!

 

[Mungo]

Fair point and hadn’t even thought about barrel length. Totally agree academic, a deer wouldn’t notice the difference at normal ranges. Just curious whether the Swede could be ‘better’ with the larger case but I assume very little in it.

Generally it seems there’s so little in it that the measurement error is bigger.

 

[HonestJohn]

Unless you reload, choose based on 1. The rifle you want and like, 2. What good quality factory ammo is continuously available locally to you, with one or two good quality alternatives to help you find the right ammo and be able to keep using it

 

[bowji john]

I have both

I load the creed a bit faster (2750) than the swede (2650)

Both use 143ELDx

The rifle and barrel length are more significant I find

The creed has a 26” barrel - used for ELR

Swede has a 23” Blaser barrel - used for stalking

To be honest, if they had been the other way around I don’t think I’d notice any real differences

Both use the same powder - RS 62

 

[Bowland blades]

Folks, what is the real life difference between these two calibers if you home load? I’m asking purely from an academic point of view as I realise they will be very similar.

6.5x55 has larger case capacity. Can it outperform the 6.5CM if home loaded? Would you have to load the Swede very ‘hot’ just to keep up with a standard 6.5CM round?

Does the 6.5CM use a faster burning powder than the Swede so it does better in a smaller case?


My main curiosity is that I picked out a Swede for the old man and I’ve used it occasionally. Effective caliber although I was surprised how much the trajectory changed over 200 yards compared to my .270. That being said, if I was buying new now, the creedmoor does seem like the sensible choice.


As a side note, which is your favourite 6.5 bullet? Our Swede seems to shoot 140 grain bullets better than 120. Currently using 143 eldx, very accurate but quite a lot of bruising!

Favourite deer bullet in the 6.5 mm is the 100 grain barnes TTSX launched at 3300 fps from my 260 rem. The thing i will say is keep this side of 400 yards unless you raise a bit more velocity and obviously are competent to shoot that far on living things ( expansion really drops off from that point ) 6.5 sweed 6.5 creed 260 rem all have very similar ballistics the creed will take longer bullets and will have the twist rate to handle them . The other two you need to check 1-8 is the new normal , i run 1-7.5 some of the sweeds will be a tad slow on the twist for todays long high BC bullets especially in copper ammo .
Dont buy a 260 rem unless you dont really care to use factory ammo , its like unicorn eggs to find in something useful in the gun shops.

 

[tim@tcs]

All this talk about how much can I push a bullet faster is academic and unless you are into experimenting with handloading absolutely unimportant. 6.5 swede is a great classic cartridge capable of taking the biggest game available in Scandinavia. You have been able to buy the ammo for over a hundred years, will the Creedmoor still be available in 100 years?

 

[Foxyboy43]

Folks, what is the real life difference between these two calibers if you home load? I’m asking purely from an academic point of view as I realise they will be very similar.

6.5x55 has larger case capacity. Can it outperform the 6.5CM if home loaded? Would you have to load the Swede very ‘hot’ just to keep up with a standard 6.5CM round?

Does the 6.5CM use a faster burning powder than the Swede so it does better in a smaller case?


My main curiosity is that I picked out a Swede for the old man and I’ve used it occasionally. Effective caliber although I was surprised how much the trajectory changed over 200 yards compared to my .270. That being said, if I was buying new now, the creedmoor does seem like the sensible choice.


As a side note, which is your favourite 6.5 bullet? Our Swede seems to shoot 140 grain bullets better than 120. Currently using 143 eldx, very accurate but quite a lot of bruising!

The Creedmore has been the rifle manufacturers’ dream advertising model - marketing a “new“ chambering which err, it simply isn‘t .
So the simple “difference” answer is a few grains of powder for the same type, calibre and weight of bullet and the Creedmoor is a shorter case which apparently feeds better though as far as I am aware the 100+ years old 6.5 Swedish and it’s more recent SE has no such reported feeding issues. Beyond that no real difference that you or the deer would notice.
I use 120gns Sierra Prohunters and 130 gns Game Changers in my SE over moderate loads of Viht N160 - nothing has gone on yet…..

 

[tacklerat]

I have a very nice Mauser actioned 7x57 which I hand load for. I used to have a 270 but prefer the 7x57. Like the Swede, some of this comes down to what you like on a personal level. The Swede is better when it's hand loaded, but as someone pointed out it really needs a long action. Also, the factory ammo is loaded down due to some of the older Mauser actions around that won't handle higher pressures of today's rifles. I doubt that any animal you shoot with either cartridge will be in a position to tell the difference. As for me, I have a Tikka Lite in the Creed and a Savage LRP also in Creedmoor. But I've always had that idea in the back of my mind that I could find a home for a Swede, just to go with the 7x57. (pictured)

 

[NullMac]

Swede doesn't make use of the long action, there are better loadings. Not sure action length really matters but it does to some.

Biggest difference is likely to be factory loadings. CM is all modern point bullets so very efficient even if it's not earth shattering. Swede loads is inevitably more traditional.

However if you wanted to go wildcat and ackley the Swede it is a different beast, but you don't even need to do that now with the PRC having arrived.

Where's that 7PRC @caberslash is always promising me...

 

[maximus otter]

The 6.5 x 55mm has been doing everything that's asked of it, and with extreme accuracy, for almost 130 years. It'll drop any deer in the UK with authority.

The 6.5 Creedmoor (CreedMOOR...) is the flavour of the month. Remember when 6.8 SPC was flavour of the month? 6.5 WSSM? Try buying a rifle in those calibres today...

maximus otter

 

[Swedish]

 

[Foxyboy43]

The Creedmore has been the rifle manufacturers’ dream advertising model - marketing a “new“ chambering which err, it simply isn‘t .
So the simple “difference” answer is a few grains of powder for the same type, calibre and weight of bullet and the Creedmoor is a shorter case which apparently feeds better though as far as I am aware the 100+ years old 6.5 Swedish and it’s more recent SE has no such reported feeding issues. Beyond that no real difference that you or the deer would notice.
I use 120gns Sierra Prohunters and 130 gns Game Changers in my SE over moderate loads of Viht N160 - nothing has gone on yet…..

Yep - I fell for it myself - CreedMORE - derivative of NEEDmore! It is of course Creedmoor as per line 2.
Silly FB…

 

[nun_hunter]

In a bolt action rifle and everything being equal there is a minute difference, if at all.

In the UK we forget that the Creedmoor was designed to be able to work effectively in semi auto rifles too, a huge market elsewhere in the world.

The Creedmoor will be around to stay compared to other "new" cartridges due to the fact it's been heavily adopted by ammo and rifle manufacturers and it does a lot of things well so has wide appeal.

 

[huntsman]

Have to agree with nun-hunter the creedmoor is here to stay, as so many US companies have big it up , pumped heaps of dollars into it and use the platform to lunching their new and improved “SUPER” calibers !!
They are just reinventing the wheel! And we will happily go along with it and buy into it. Sure there are the small percentage guys out there that will eek that something more out of the like of the creedmoor vs some of the other older 6.5 calibers. For most of us shooting out to 200 yd at UK sized deer the difference is tiny.

I started out with a 6.5x55 and would gladly have one again in the morning ,it was so smooth to shoot and you always saw your strike.I switched to 308win for years and shot plenty but never liked it . Now, the 270 win and I love it, reminds me of the 120gr noslers in the x55 with a pinch more hot sauce.
It would be nice to think that the reliable old swede could co exist and continue to be used. Maybe wishful thinking!