New planting and brambles

[GlennUK]

Dear all

not sure if we have any forestry wizards on here but have a question re planting and brambles.

About 5 years ago we planted c.2000 native tress in our back field. At the time we had some patches of bramble but seeing prior to this the field had been cut for us by our neighbours they weren't signficant. The company that planted the tress said to leave the brambles as they will deter the deer (not entirely clear that has worked!).

Anyway five years down the line the tress have grown substantially,(those that have not been attacked by the fallow), but around and amongst some of the trees are large bramble patches, in some cases c.1,5-1.8m in height around the planted trees.

My natural inclination would be to try to remove them, but i am torn as ) it will be a lot of work, and b) i am unsure whether it is necessary where the tress 'imbedded' appear to be growing anyway?

Any thoughts, points appreciated.

Thanks Glenn

 

[jall55]

Dear all

not sure if we have any forestry wizards on here but have a question re planting and brambles.

About 5 years ago we planted c.2000 native tress in our back field. At the time we had some patches of bramble but seeing prior to this the field had been cut for us by our neighbours they weren't signficant. The company that planted the tress said to leave the brambles as they will deter the deer (not entirely clear that has worked!).

Anyway five years down the line the tress have grown substantially,(those that have not been attacked by the fallow), but around and amongst some of the trees are large bramble patches, in some cases c.1,5-1.8m in height around the planted trees.

My natural inclination would be to try to remove them, but i am torn as ) it will be a lot of work, and b) i am unsure whether it is necessary where the tress 'imbedded' appear to be growing anyway?

Any thoughts, points appreciated.

Thanks Glenn

This is what you have created - habitat - The trees will be OK after 5 years - Its more a case now of clearing "some " bramble to allow other plants some light. How close together are the tress - i go "through" my woods and create rides with the digger - but in the past have used the hedge cutter.
Whatever you decide wait another couple of months as birds will perhaps be nesting amongst them

 

[HonestJohn]

Be a little harder on the fallow

 

[Dunwaters]

Brambles are very invasive, but what to do depends very much on what you want.
If you want a nice open woodland to walk through and enjoy, you have to manage it that way, or plant dense thickets of Sitka that choke out the competition.
It’s the same with ivy, you need to decide and manage it accordingly.
Your woodlands, your rules, but just like dogs woodland needs rules.

 

[mudman]

Trees will grow and eventually shade out the brambles once the canopy closes, cutting out the light to the woodland floor.

 

[Kalahari]

The muntjac will like the bramble cover. How you see that is your decision.

David.

 

[co’den]

Mow a few rides with a mulcher or flail to give you access, and maybe clear a bigger safe shooting area to encourage the deer to feed. Apart from that, let it do its thing.

 

[yellabelly]

Jack Hargreaves said on out-of-town programme many years ago rabbits control brambles by eating the tips out the shoots where they touch down
I presume that's why brambles have now got to the edges of motorways, no rabbits

 

[old 30-06]

My vote will go with co'den's suggestions. I think he has it spot on.

 

[Apthorpe]

I'd leave the brambles, except for cutting any strands weighing down or covering the leaders of trees.
They'll thin out, the trees grow and shade them out. Otherwise, you'll create continual work cutting back vegetation twice a year for it only to grow straight back.

 

[Adanhewitt]

It’s good cover for nesting birds I would wait until winter time and start cutting rides through taking the brambles out. It will make it easier to maintain the trees and replant if necessary. Also easier to see the deer for control.

 

[GlennUK]

This is what you have created - habitat - The trees will be OK after 5 years - Its more a case now of clearing "some " bramble to allow other plants some light. How close together are the tress - i go "through" my woods and create rides with the digger - but in the past have used the hedge cutter.
Whatever you decide wait another couple of months as birds will perhaps be nesting amongst them

Thanks, we worked with the woodland trusts and threes were originally planted for coppicing so relatively close. Although since they have been planted we have lost a few here and there, the Fallow just love to rub against the young tress. When they were planted we had rides made around the edge and a sunset strip up the middle. The sunset strip faces due west so midsummers day the sun sets at the far end, and shines right into our our house (assuming its not cloudy which it has been a few times since.

Il l bear the advice re nesting birds and will clear some of the bigger patches.

 

[GlennUK]

Be a little harder on the fallow

LOL some while back my stalking friend asked if it was ok to shoot in our patch, at the time we declined, but he shoots the surrounding fields which the Fallow need to pass through to get to ours.

However, i am now awaiting the arrival of my DSC1 cert (assuming I've passed ) and will be shooting some for the pot.

 

[GlennUK]

Brambles are very invasive, but what to do depends very much on what you want.
If you want a nice open woodland to walk through and enjoy, you have to manage it that way, or plant dense thickets of Sitka that choke out the competition.
It’s the same with ivy, you need to decide and manage it accordingly.
Your woodlands, your rules, but just like dogs woodland needs rules.

Thanks the objective was to plant native species for wildlife long term, and although they're planted for coppicing, truth is i doubt by the time they're large enough ill be doing that (or if i do wont be much of it).

 

[GlennUK]

Trees will grow and eventually shade out the brambles once the canopy closes, cutting out the light to the woodland floor.

Thanks we thought that too, its just this period before the trees are providing signficnat shading to the underlying plants we were concerned that the brambles may be signfciantly detrimental to the tress long term health, and instead of a nice wood, we end up with a few tress with a couple of acres of brambles in between.

 

[GlennUK]

The muntjac will like the bramble cover. How you see that is your decision.

David.

Interesting, a similar comment was made on my DSC1 course about Muntjac liking brambles, we do see them but they come in and dont seem to hang around. Where i live (close to J28, M25) we get large herds of Fallow and i see Muntjac regularly when driving around, esp early mornings, had never really thought about the woods/brambles as being a deer friendly environment per se.

 

[GlennUK]

Mow a few rides with a mulcher or flail to give you access, and maybe clear a bigger safe shooting area to encourage the deer to feed. Apart from that, let it do its thing.

Thanks, the sunset strip we have mown gives me clear line of sight/safe backstop to shoot from an elevated position for pretty much the length of my land c.250m. Speaking with my mentor, he has suggested putting up a high seat or two which would give me other areas to shoot again providing the backstop required.

Since living here and planting the tress, i know the places the deer like to graze and where they like to lay up at various times, which will aid my stalking. I also have perm to shoot any legal quarry on the neighbouring farm (c.1000acres) so wont be short of opportunities.

 

[GlennUK]

Dear All

Thanks for the helpful suggestions and comments.

We have c.10acres with this field being about 8.5 of that. When we moved in nothing had been done with it and it was largely tall grass, with nowt else apart from some brambles.

Before having the tress planted our neighbouring farmer came and cut if for us a couple of times. Our land is surrounded by what might be described as a mature/wild hedge with trees and shrubs of varying species, but generally pretty deep in some places probably >10m wide, with some mature tress, oaks primarily but other species as well.

End of 2019, we planted 1600 trees (oak, birch, field maple, hornbeam, etc) , 1600 'shrubs' (blackthorn, hawthorn, dog rose, hazel, etc), topped up about 18 months later with another 425 trees. What i notice now is that the variety of plants and animals has changed. More wild flowers to go with the brambles, and thistles, but slowly it is changing, and as to the wildlife, we have badgers, we dont see them but the spoor is around, last week one was killed almost right outside our front door. Foxes, rabbits a 'resident hare', moles, voles, plus loads of bird life, along with the Fallow and Muntjac.

 

[big ears]

Dear All

Thanks for the helpful suggestions and comments.

We have c.10acres with this field being about 8.5 of that. When we moved in nothing had been done with it and it was largely tall grass, with nowt else apart from some brambles.

Before having the tress planted our neighbouring farmer came and cut if for us a couple of times. Our land is surrounded by what might be described as a mature/wild hedge with trees and shrubs of varying species, but generally pretty deep in some places probably >10m wide, with some mature tress, oaks primarily but other species as well.

End of 2019, we planted 1600 trees (oak, birch, field maple, hornbeam, etc) , 1600 'shrubs' (blackthorn, hawthorn, dog rose, hazel, etc), topped up about 18 months later with another 425 trees. What i notice now is that the variety of plants and animals has changed. More wild flowers to go with the brambles, and thistles, but slowly it is changing, and as to the wildlife, we have badgers, we dont see them but the spoor is around, last week one was killed almost right outside our front door. Foxes, rabbits a 'resident hare', moles, voles, plus loads of bird life, along with the Fallow and Muntjac.

And I guess tonnes of pollinators. Please don’t forget the insects.
By not feeding the grass and reducing nitrogen more wild flowers will start to show and dock, nettle and grass will be slowly weakened.
As to the bramble leave it to flower before cutting it’s a really valuable source of nectar. If you can leave some open spaces to encourage clover, dandelions and field flowers this will also be of benefit.
Our pollinators biggest risk is habitat loss and it sounds like you have done a great job.

 

[GlennUK]

And I guess tonnes of pollinators. Please don’t forget the insects.
By not feeding the grass and reducing nitrogen more wild flowers will start to show and dock, nettle and grass will be slowly weakened.
As to the bramble leave it to flower before cutting it’s a really valuable source of nectar. If you can leave some open spaces to encourage clover, dandelions and field flowers this will also be of benefit.
Our pollinators biggest risk is habitat loss and it sounds like you have done a great job.

Points noted. There are areas we have left as grass around the place, although we have used weed killers in some areas of our plot, the field is untouched by us in this respect.

Our back garden is c.half an acre of which we leave about a half of it unmown until the buttercups cease flowering, primarily because where we sit and eat looks out over this and its lovely to see a sea of yellow flowers gently swaying in the breeze (that happens between the strong gusting winds and heavy rain of the past week or two).

We also have small area c.100m2 we call the orchard, where my wife has spent countless hours trying to get wild flowers to grown and seed. Not to mention the cost of wild flower seed to start with. That's v.much WIP but lots of ox eye daises, yellow rattle, goats beard, along with a few others.