Lead ammunition restrictions - government announcement

[Leec6.5]

No, you're very wrong there. Its barely deer legal ffs at max charge not only that, its usable range is 250 yards for reliable expansion. That most certainly does not tick the boxs.

Stop talking utter crap for once. And that data is max charge from vihts website

99% of this whole thread is

 

[Smellydog]

The future.

And what that about!? Split from top to bottom!

Not found any wads .
Progress, I must of understood what that is....

 

[enfieldspares]

There been a few very good answers to this statement, but Ill add one.
Having to 'prove' you dont, and wont cause harm in future, is a fallacy, its like saying you cant have a driving licence unless you can prove youll never cause an accident, or be issued an FAC/SGC unless you can prove you wont shoot a person.

The amount of harm spent lead projectiles has caused is not a measurable thing, its a loose estimate, likely over exaggerated (due to the bodies compiling the data) but is a useful weapon in demonising shooters.
If the WHO, REACH GOVUK ect really wanted us to stop using lead they wouldnt need to ban it, but they have anyway, but you could simply slap a tarrif or tax on lead ammunition of certain types, make it more expensive than steel/copper projectiles, and there would be a natural drift away from it, whilst still giving a choice to those who must/want to use it and pay for it ?
Banning (making illegal to use) a metal in one context, gives power and will to think about the next ban, copper, steel and plastic wads, making the case that we need to 'prove' that they dont cause harm....
In effect they ban private gun ownership, because no one can use the ammunition designed for it, without actually legally banning them.

There is sense in this. And as sure as night follows day there will be cries over micro plastics as soon as the last lead shot loaded cartridge has been fired. That and the force feeding of steel shot (iron shot) to wildfowl to create clumps of rusted together shot in their gizzards so that a call to ban that can then be made about the "thousands of wildfowl choking to death on fired iron shot".

 

[Tim.243]

The future.
View attachment 428730
And what that about!? Split from top to bottom!
View attachment 428731
Not found any wads .
Progress, I must of understood what that is....

12 teal on Feb 20th 32gm 4's no splits

 

[hendrix's rifle]

99% of this whole thread is

Amen to that

 

[Callumno112]

You have 3 years to use up your stocks of lead ammunition, after that you have very limited options.
If you follow the EU REACH proposals ( and you seem to be in lock step with them ) the sale, use and possession of prohibited lead ammunition will become illegal after the transition period.
Expect regular checks of game on dealers racks to monitor progress during the transition period and expect more monitoring post transition period with questions being asked and possibly prosecutions to follow.
You’ll probably get away with using lead if you keep quiet and just eat the stuff yourself, but the commercial sector will transition.
To those of you threatening to buy .22 centre fires specifically to shoot deer with lead ammunition post ban, I ask why?
Do you really think that a hot .22 using lead will perform better than a slightly larger caliber using non lead?
I shot deer with hot .22’s for over 20 years, they come with serious drawbacks, especially for the 3 larger species.

Do you think they will actually be able to enforce it? Given the struggle to manage the FAC process due to resourcing and cost, I can’t imagine this being policed over more pressing issues!

 

[Smellydog]

12 teal on Feb 20th 32gm 4's no splits
View attachment 428733

Did you find any wads? I didn't.

 

[Terry2016]

It seemed a bit strange as you never post much then a flurry of work related posts!
Shoot closed with covid!

i don't get on as much as i would like - i see some genuine questions so trying to help people out.

Sorry to hear that, was a nice spot you had there.

 

[Conor O'Gorman]

There is sense in this. And as sure as night follows day there will be cries over micro plastics as soon as the last lead shot loaded cartridge has been fired. That and the force feeding of steel shot (iron shot) to wildfowl to create clumps of rusted together shot in their gizzards so that a call to ban that can then be made about the "thousands of wildfowl choking to death on fired iron shot".

Steel shot has been used for decades for live quarry shooting in the UK, mainland Europe, USA etc. with field research done on presence in gizzards and no reports of birds choked to death from clumps of rusted shot in gizzards. Why then would you you post this scaremongering nonsense?

 

[Rewulf]

Steel shot has been used for decades for live quarry shooting in the UK, mainland Europe, USA etc. with field research done on presence in gizzards and no reports of birds choked to death from clumps of rusted shot in gizzards. Why then would you you post this scaremongering nonsense?

Interesting, so they don't eat steel shot, only lead ?
Must have a very selective palate......

 

[Dunwaters]

When a BASC employee states that BASC has always opposed the introduction of further lead restrictions when as an employee of BASC he continually posts information in support of further lead shot restrictions I would say that is the very definition of hypocrisy.
Hypocrisy definition , the practice of feigning to be what one is not or to believe what one does not.

I call it being pragmatic.
I’ve explained why it happened.
If you can’t accept that, fine, don’t.
But don’t confuse pragmatism hypocrisy.

 

[Dunwaters]

I have endlessly repeated those allegations to you yet you refuse to acknowledge them and seem to deliberately misinterpret rather than acknowledge my point.
The point I am making is the bizarre occurrence of a BASC employee spending an enormous amount of daytime while presumably in the employ of BASC promoting justification for further lead shot restrictions when BASC policy is to oppose those restrictions. I’m calling it out as hypocrisy you are defending it.
Are you stating that this never occurred?

No, but I don’t see it as hypocrisy.

 

[Dunwaters]

See above

I have, twice, and your accusation is inaccurate and incorrect.
BASC was in a position where they knew that change was coming, they didn’t support the change but they did have to prepare their members for change while negotiating on their behalf.
So not in the least bit hypocritical.

 

[Dunwaters]

As stated earlier it’s commonly agreed that you can’t prove a negative. See Rewulf’s post #918

I’ve seen it, I’ve also read the European proposal for the ban on lead ammunition and fishing weights.
You should read it yourself, it is on this site somewhere from a while back.
We weren’t asked to prove a negative, we were asked to prove how our continued use of lead can be justified.

 

[Dunwaters]

Do you think they will actually be able to enforce it? Given the struggle to manage the FAC process due to resourcing and cost, I can’t imagine this being policed over more pressing issues!

As I already said, it depends on the penalties. Would you be willing to risk a hefty fine and loss of certs?
If you’re just mooching about on your own behalf you’re probably safe enough, but why would you take the chance?

 

[Dunwaters]

Pot kettle.

Lovely.
And you were doing so well.

 

[Dunwaters]

See above

Can you do us both a favour and keep all your comments together please?
We both end up repeating ourselves.

 

[Tim.243]

Did you find any wads? I didn't.

Just Teal and footprints

 

[enfieldspares]

Why then would you you post this scaremongering nonsense?

The same as field research is also not the same as the deliberate dosing of captive wildfowl with lead shot that lead to the ban on such in the USA. Let's wait and see when studies involving dosing of captive wildfowl with iron shot are commissioned. As they will be by the anti-shooting organisations.

But anyway I thought with you posts about young partridge surrounded by minefields of spent lead shot that it was now open season for posting scaremongering nonsense on SD. I didn't really want to leave the monopoly on that to you. And the old adage about pots and kettles springs to mind.

And where are all those "thousands" of birds dead from ingesting lead shot? Or the ones at risk, after digging down the six or eight inches in is embedded into my back lawn, to then eat it, from the lead shot fired from my 9mm Rimfire Webley & Scott garden gun to recently kill my rat?

 

[Ruger#1]

I call it being pragmatic.
I’ve explained why it happened.
If you can’t accept that, fine, don’t.
But don’t confuse pragmatism hypocrisy.

Your latest blinkered denial of the obvious reminds me of an Alice in Wonderland where Humpty Dumpty states that when he uses a word it means just what he chooses it to mean nothing more nothing less.
Up until now I had given you the benefit of the doubt thinking that perhaps you were a little slow hence my repeated attempts at explanation of my point.
It seems however you are just an apologist for a BASC employee more concerned with his favoured topics of partridges and inconclusive lead ingestion figures rather than acting in the best interests of the shooting community.
Just how far does this pragmatism take you and how much are you prepared to compromise going down that route. Regardless , I’ll not be wasting my time indulging you further, life’s too short to bother with zealots incapable of critical thought.