Help to ID mystery calibre…

[Landy99]

I inherited these cases. I can’t find out what they are and it’s bugging me! Any help appreciated.

Not .45-90 as the body tapers on this one.
Not .458 Win Mag as this one is rimmed.

Dimensions:
OAL: 2.5”
Bullet: 0.45”
Body tapers from: 0.568” to 0.483”
Diameter of rimmed head: 0.654”

 

[Landy99]

The nearest I can find is a .45 New South Wales but the measurements don’t quite match.

 

[tackb]

no head stamp?

 

[Landy99]

no head stamp?

Sorry, should have mentioned that there is no head stamp.

 

[shakey jake]

could it be a 410?

 

[Landy99]

could it be a 410?

I hadn’t thought of that! Thought you’d cracked it but .410 doesn’t quite match up with the dimensions either. Thanks anyway.

 

[Smellydog]

Maybe some clues here...

Buffalo Cartridges of the American Frontier

 

[tackb]

it's not 45 danish is it? 11.7x59r ?

 

[sh1kar]

Hmm I was going to say 450 Black Powder Express but case isn't quite long enough

s

 

[HonestJohn]

45-70 that’s been reloaded so slightly out of spec?

 

[MarinePMI]

Are you sure you don't just have .45 Basic or Basic Longs (aka the parent long blank 45-XX case to form other cases)?

Just google ".45 Basic " for more details.

Norma Brass 45 Basic

 

[MarinePMI]

Are you sure you don't just have .45 Basic or Basic Longs (aka the parent long blank 45-XX case to form other cases)?

Just google ".45 Basic " for more details.

Norma Brass 45 Basic

If it is 45 Basic, here's a link to the cases that can be formed from it.

45 Basic Case Forming Data | Duck Creek Sporting Goods

Maybe it's a 44-70 Maynard?

 

[MarinePMI]

Poking around, it seems like it may be a 45-100 case.

Reloading Data .45-100 (2.6-inch) Sharps Metallic

 

[Sinistral]

I inherited these cases. I can’t find out what they are and it’s bugging me! Any help appreciated.
Not .45-90 as the body tapers on this one.
Not .458 Win Mag as this one is rimmed.

Dimensions:
OAL: 2.5”
Bullet: 0.45”
Body tapers from: 0.568” to 0.483”
Diameter of rimmed head: 0.654”

I was going on the dimensions posted, which are different.
Is there a typo or mistake in the OP?
All the cases which can be formed from .45 BASIC are .45/70 head-size.

Dimensions: OAL: 2.5” Bullet: 0.45” Body tapers from: 0.568” to 0.483” Diameter of rimmed head: 0.654”

C.I.P./SAAMI standards	L1​	L2​	L3​	R1Ø​	P1Ø​	P2Ø​	H2Ø​	G1Ø​	SA°​
.45-90 Win	-​	-​	2.400​	.608​	.505​	-​	.481​	.458​	n/a​
.40-60 Win	1.223​	1.445​	1.870​	.630​	.506​	.445​	.430​	.406​	2​
.45-60 Win	1.303​	1.444​	1.890​	.629​	.506​	.488​	.483​	.459​	1​
.45/70 GOVT (Rt=.078")	-	-​	2.105​	.608​	.506​	-​	.480​	.458​	n/a​
.457 WWG Mag (SAAMI -1999)	-​	-​	2.210​	.608​	.506​	-​	.480​	.458​	n/a​
.38-56 Win	1.227​	1.472​	2.105​	.606​	.506​	.447​	.403​	.375​	n/c​
.33 Win	1.612​	1.736​	2.105​	.610​	.508​	.441​	.366​	.338​	16​
MYSTERY (")	-​	-​	2.500​	.654	.568	-​	.483​	.450​	n/a​

 

[MarinePMI]

I was going on the dimensions posted, which are different.
Is there a typo or mistake in the OP?
All the cases which can be formed from .45 BASIC are .45/70 head-size.

Dimensions: OAL: 2.5” Bullet: 0.45” Body tapers from: 0.568” to 0.483” Diameter of rimmed head: 0.654”

C.I.P./SAAMI standards	L1​	L2​	L3​	R1Ø​	P1Ø​	P2Ø​	H2Ø​	G1Ø​	SA°​
.45-90 Win	-​	-​	2.400​	.608​	.505​	-​	.481​	.458​	n/a​
.40-60 Win	1.223​	1.445​	1.870​	.630​	.506​	.445​	.430​	.406​	2​
.45-60 Win	1.303​	1.444​	1.890​	.629​	.506​	.488​	.483​	.459​	1​
.45/70 GOVT (Rt=.078")	-	-​	2.105​	.608​	.506​	-​	.480​	.458​	n/a​
.457 WWG Mag (SAAMI -1999)	-​	-​	2.210​	.608​	.506​	-​	.480​	.458​	n/a​
.38-56 Win	1.227​	1.472​	2.105​	.606​	.506​	.447​	.403​	.375​	n/c​
.33 Win	1.612​	1.736​	2.105​	.610​	.508​	.441​	.366​	.338​	16​
MYSTERY (")	-​	-​	2.500​	.654	.568	-​	.483​	.450​	n/a​

I was suspecting some typos or just the normal dial caliper errors when trying to make an accurate measurement. Especially since the case he showed was straight walled. It immediately brought to mind a time I was walking through a ammunition machinery bone yard, and I walked past a machined that had been stopped while making 45 Basic brass, with the partially formed cases spilled out onto the ground. They hand been bunted, but still didn't have flash holes. When I saw the OP's case, and it's nearly straight walls, I just thought "raw case" or "basic case".

Some retailers here in the US occasionally sell "basic" brass for those of us that like to wildcat rounds.

Basic Brass - Rifle Brass - Metallic Reloading - Graf & Sons

 

[kenbro]

Bryce Towesly wrote a good book.
The Handloaders Manual of Cartridge conversions.
KB.

 

[Smellydog]

With no head stamp it has probably just started as a basic case.
Sharps had many cases for just one example of the many rifle makers at the start of the previous century.

 

[Sinistral]

Bryce Towesly wrote a good book.
The Handloaders Manual of Cartridge conversions.
KB.

The author is JJ Donnelly, Ken, and the pic in #2 shows a page. I've got a hardcopy, but it's online now with free access (a few mistakes in it alas).

I was suspecting some typos or just the normal dial caliper errors when trying to make an accurate measurement. Especially since the case he showed was straight walled. It immediately brought to mind a time I was walking through a ammunition machinery bone yard, and I walked past a machined that had been stopped while making 45 Basic brass, with the partially formed cases spilled out onto the ground. They hand been bunted, but still didn't have flash holes. When I saw the OP's case, and it's nearly straight walls, I just thought "raw case" or "basic case".

Some retailers here in the US occasionally sell "basic" brass for those of us that like to wildcat rounds.

Basic Brass - Rifle Brass - Metallic Reloading - Graf & Sons

Maybe it was silly expecting that someone asking for an ID would have double-checked the facts, and posted the right measurements.
Trawling through the databases with these turned nothing up. The thought that this might be a 'Basic Case' just didn't occur to me. In the UK we can get these in Bertram Brass of Aus from Kranks, who are the main importers. I've formed some in .405 Win, and still have a few in 9.3x82R to convert. You've reminded me that the great thing about this site is how much expertise is on tap, and how generous members from all over the shooting world are in imparting what they know.

 

[Sinistral]

With no head stamp it has probably just started as a basic case.
Sharps had many cases for just one example of the many rifle makers at the start of the previous century.

Generally the bunter stamp impressions were carefully done on generic cases because of their importance to users.
The only reason I can think why they're not present is because the rims have been thinned to fit something.

 

[Aister]

I have a piece of brass in my collection that is HDS 45 BASIC. I can't be 100% sure its not been sized for something before I got it but here are the dimensions

Head diameter, 601
Body, .501 - .485ish
OAL 3.246