Problems zeroing my new 30-06

devon deer stalker

Well-Known Member
Hi All,
I collected my new 30-06 Browning X-Bolt with a wildcat predator 8 moderator on Christmas eve.
Itching to zero it i accepted an invite from a friend on the forum to join him whilst he zeroed his 7mm.
I had a box of 150 grain Winchester cartridges and off we went.
But could i get it to zero, now way, doubt crept in, so i assumed it must be the man behind the gun, namely me, so i tried his 7mm, no problem and put 6 rounds in a 1'' hole at 100 yards.
So i let him try my rifle, same problem, couldn't get it to shoot consistently.
Then i ran out of bullets (will be re-loading soon just waiting for postman!) so we couldn't try without the mod on.
So i got home and made sure everything was tight, which it was.
But now i think i have found out what it might be, when i screw the mod on the plastic screw in end of the mod touches the barrel, in other words it doesn't just shround the barrel.
I have contacted the company who stated i can ream out the plastic nut without voiding the warranty, but i might get the gun shop to do it.
Watch this space, i will let you know how it goes.
Cheers
Richard
 
By the sound of things, the plastic shroud has not been reemed out enough.

Thus the mod may not be screwing fully on. ( not tight against thr shoulder of muzzle thread)

Rgds Uncle Buck.
 
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But now i think i have found out what it might be, when i screw the mod on the plastic screw in end of the mod touches the barrel, in other words it doesn't just shround the barrel.

The bushing on the predator 8 is meant to be a contact fit, i.e. it is supposed to touch the barrel. If you call wildcat they can confirm what the tolerance should be.

What sort of group size were you getting? The most obvious test would be to remove the mod and see how it shoots without. Then you can start troubleshooting....

Alex
 
Certainly sounds like you have solved the problem (fingers crossed)! Does the plastic bush screw out on this mod, I am not familiar with them, if so you could just take it out(?)

Hope you get it sorted.

ATB

Tom
 
Yes i did ring the manufacturer and they said nothing about it being designed to be in contact with the barrel, and would not have a problem with it being reamed out, i always was of the opinion that nothing should come into contact with a free floating barrel, perhaps i'm wrong.
The plastic piece does screw out easily to work on.
I will remove the mod and try again, just going into Exeter to pick up some more ammo.
Cheers
Richard
 
Yes i did ring the manufacturer and they said nothing about it being designed to be in contact with the barrel, and would not have a problem with it being reamed out, i always was of the opinion that nothing should come into contact with a free floating barrel, perhaps i'm wrong.
The plastic piece does screw out easily to work on.
I will remove the mod and try again, just going into Exeter to pick up some more ammo.
Cheers
Richard

Who did you speak to at Wildcat? :-|

I have three wildcats and the bushings are all contact fit as per Andrew Banner's instructions. I forget the exact spec, something like barrel diameter + x thou.

The problem you have if the bushing doesn't touch at rest (but almost touches) is that it might touch during firing, so you could get unpredictable results as it will sometimes be touching and sometimes not. The idea of the contact fit is that the pressure on the barrel is consistent and therefore doesn't cause unreliable results. The barrel is still 'floating', it's just that the mod is now considered part of that barrel.

Unfortunately Wildcat have no fitting instructions on their site but by way of an example the P8 is supposed to work in exactly the same way as the T8, if you check out the docs on the T8 you'll see the bushing should be barrel diameter +.02mm which, in engineering terms, is a contact fit.

http://jacksonrifles.com/zz-silencers/files/t8-t4-manual.pdf

If you are going to increase the bushing so that it is non-contact then make sure there is enough clearance that it can never touch. But not having a contact fit goes against what wildcat have told me in the past and defeats the purpose of having the bushing there in the first place, so I'm at a loss as to why they haven't mentioned it to you. :confused:

Alex
 
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Sorry Devon Deer Stalker,

All of these over barrel type moderators bushes, come into contact with the barrel on final tighting.

With the exception of the ASU north star.

But as said by Sikamalc, possibly try different Ammo

Rgds Uncle Buck
 
If it turns out that removing the mod solves the accuracy problem another thing to look at is the clearance between barrel and stock when the mod is on. Sometimes the extra weight of the mod on the end of the barrel (particularly when combined with a bipod pushing up at the end of the stock) can cause interference problems between stock and barrel when firing.

Alex
 
Who did you speak to at Wildcat? :-|

Alex
Not sure what you mean by adding suspicious?
Anyway i rang back and spoke to the same guy called Mark, he discussed it with Andy once again and he did state it should in fact touch the barrel.
His suggestion was fit the mod, draw a pencil line on the barrel,remove plastic bushing, refit mod to check it is completely screwing down, then refit.
But i will try some different ammo with the mod off and start from scratch again.
I did make sure the barrel was free floating with the mod on.
Cheers
Richard
 
If you are going to ream the bush out so that it doesn't touch then why not just take it out altogether? Personally I think that any factory rifle with any factory ammo should group to 1-2 moa. If it doesn't then either the rifle or the ammo are not fit for purpose.

A lot of screw cutting and moderator fitting is done these days by unskilled people. You should be able to start the mod on the thread, give it a spin and watch it come to a dead stop. If it doesn't then it then there will always be a variable factor which is never a good thing.

When you get some more cartridges I would fire two five round groups with the mod on, two with it off and if none of these show promise then I would take the whole set-up back to the shop or seller. At £25-£40 a box, its not worth wasteing ammo on chasing problems.

Looking at your location, I hope that you didn't buy from a large local shop with a big advertising budget! If you did then I can only wish you the best of luck!

JC
 
This would also be my first port of call. Mod and bipod on then try a piece of paper between barrel and stock to make sure there is still clearance.
 
Brand new rifle.......... mod fitted properly........... Scope and mounts fitted properly

Dosnt hold true ............ after checking the above.............Change ammo..........take bipod off if it has one, this can throw out the rifle if its a free floating barrel I have seen this happen a few times.........if its a new scope could be a problem, but unlikely, unless you have a very poor scope on a 30.06 (not recommended).

Hope you get it sorted.
 
Hi All,
I collected my new 30-06 Browning X-Bolt with a wildcat predator 8 moderator on Christmas eve.
Itching to zero it i accepted an invite from a friend on the forum to join him whilst he zeroed his 7mm.
I had a box of 150 grain Winchester cartridges and off we went.
But could i get it to zero, now way, doubt crept in, so i assumed it must be the man behind the gun, namely me, so i tried his 7mm, no problem and put 6 rounds in a 1'' hole at 100 yards.
So i let him try my rifle, same problem, couldn't get it to shoot consistently.
Then i ran out of bullets (will be re-loading soon just waiting for postman!) so we couldn't try without the mod on.
So i got home and made sure everything was tight, which it was.
But now i think i have found out what it might be, when i screw the mod on the plastic screw in end of the mod touches the barrel, in other words it doesn't just shround the barrel.
I have contacted the company who stated i can ream out the plastic nut without voiding the warranty, but i might get the gun shop to do it.
Watch this space, i will let you know how it goes.
Cheers
Richard

you can remove the rear bush and shoot it without it to eliminate the bush,is the scope new or used ??
 
Thanks for all the advice and answers.
No i didn't buy from the shop with the big advertising budget, i support the long established family run small business, they beat the large shop you are referring to on service and price.
The scope is a new S&B German 8x56 with Warne mounts.
I took it back to the shop today and they agreed with the moderator manufacturer that it should touch the barrel
They took everything off and re-fitted it all, although they did say, and i agreed with them, that everything was tight and well mounted, they also bore sighted it.
However, i had left the rifle in exactly the same state after zeroing and the bore was filthy, more so than you might normally expect.
So it could be the ammo, i have bought some Federal to try.
It was zeroed off a rifle rest, but i did afterwards use the bipod, and applied pressure, and a piece of paper ran through no problem.
So it will be back to basics.
Cheers
Richard
 
If it turns out that removing the mod solves the accuracy problem another thing to look at is the clearance between barrel and stock when the mod is on. Sometimes the extra weight of the mod on the end of the barrel (particularly when combined with a bipod pushing up at the end of the stock) can cause interference problems between stock and barrel when firing.

Alex

I had a CZ that did exactly this. Was fine if I didnt over tighten the bipod screw.
 
Bush / Bushing, engineering term for material of any shape or size, machined to provide a "bearing" surface, all bushes should contact, if they do not, then they are not fulfilling their designed purpose.
 
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