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Thread: Wild Boar condition and AOLQ

  1. #1

    Wild Boar condition and AOLQ

    On existing .308 rifle: I asked my Licensing department if I should apply for a variation to add Wild Boar or request to add AOLQ.

    I was pleasantly surprised to get an email from a gentleman at the Glos. Police Firearms Licensing department to confirm that I can have Wild Boar added to my .308W without currently having land that holds Wild Boar: "Will add wild boar (the good reason legal requirement has already been established (deer) so wild boar becomes a ‘secondary purpose’ "

    I hope this information and the wording can be of use to someone.

    (PS Gloucestershire doesn't use AOLQ - a decision made by Senior Officers in the Force)
    • Do not be seduced by the marketing-men....

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Hamburger View Post
    (PS Gloucestershire doesn't use AOLQ - a decision made by Senior Officers in the Force)
    Would have just been much simpler all round if they did actually use the AOLQ condition as per 13.9 of the HO Guidance as advised by the Authorised Professional Practice from the College of Policing and the 'directive' previously issued by ACPO FELWG, in much the same way as virtually all the other FLDs in the country wouldn't it?

    I did hear that they were 'concerned' that issuing AOLQ might, just might, lay them open to criticism should some numpty think he could shoot badgers under it, (despite it being unlawful without a specific licence!). Maybe the badger lobby has enveigled it's way in there?
    Last edited by Orion; 29-04-2015 at 08:56.

  3. #3
    [QUOTE
    (PS Gloucestershire doesn't use AOLQ - a decision made by Senior Officers in the Force)[/QUOTE]

    Not entirely true. My friend who has a certificate issued by Gloucestershire has AOLQ on his certificate.
    It's the calibre of the shooter that counts not the calibre of the rifle.

  4. #4
    (PS Gloucestershire doesn't use AOLQ - a decision made by Senior Officers in the Force)
    Not entirely true. My friend who has a certificate issued by Gloucestershire has AOLQ on his certificate.
    Interesting info for those being told otherwise. Do you think that some within the Glos FLD might be working to a different agenda?

    IIRC they recently had to start allowing 'overseas' calibres/cartridges for UK use despite initially being somewhat intransigent on the subject - that was once the issue of actually working to the HO Guidance was raised at a Firearms Liaison Committee meeting.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Hamburger View Post

    (PS Gloucestershire doesn't use AOLQ - a decision made by Senior Officers in the Force)
    ask for a copy of their written reasoning to go contrary to the College of policing code of practice as required by that practice

    especially in light of them adding any quarry as asked once initial good reason for possession is given other than generating a much more paperwork and making the dept deliberately less efficient and more costly. also contrary to point two of the APP priorities




    Forces that choose not to align their activities with the Home Office Guide are required to notify the national policing lead of the Firearms and Explosives Licensing Working Group (FELWG) and provide a rationale for their decision.
    Firearms licensing

  6. #6
    applauded for following their own guidance...

    10.38 There is no requirement to establish ‘good reason’ for additional conditions or theaddition of quarry species to an existing condition where ‘good reason’ already existsfor the possession of a firearm in the first instance (See chapter 13). Firearms should beconditioned to provide flexibility with quarry shooting by allowing all lawful quarry (seeAppendix 3).

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by bewsher500 View Post
    applauded for following their own guidance...

    10.38 There is no requirement to establish ‘good reason’ for additional conditions or theaddition of quarry species to an existing condition where ‘good reason’ already existsfor the possession of a firearm in the first instance (See chapter 13). Firearms should beconditioned to provide flexibility with quarry shooting by allowing all lawful quarry (seeAppendix 3).
    I take it you're deploying some considerable amount of irony there?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by bewsher500 View Post
    applauded for following their own guidance...

    10.38 There is no requirement to establish ‘good reason’ for additional conditions or theaddition of quarry species to an existing condition where ‘good reason’ already existsfor the possession of a firearm in the first instance (See chapter 13). Firearms should beconditioned to provide flexibility with quarry shooting by allowing all lawful quarry (seeAppendix 3).

    nearly it says Allow AOLQ not still have to ask every time for each bit but not argue just grant run more paperwork

  9. #9
    Thanks for all the views.
    My point was that until now I assumed you had to have written permission from a landowner confirming the presence of wild boar and the permission to shoot it. So that is not actually the case, you will get the wild boar condition providing good reason (deer) has already been established.
    Based on that argument will somebody now ask for wild boar to be added to their .243W ?
    • Do not be seduced by the marketing-men....

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Erik Hamburger View Post
    My point was that until now I assumed you had to have written permission from a landowner confirming the presence of wild boar and the permission to shoot it. So that is not actually the case, you will get the wild boar condition providing good reason (deer) has already been established.
    I think this can have a few answers dependant on the circumstances surrounding the application made by the FAC holder and whether or not the FLD in question are applying the current HO Guidance or not.

    If the application is made for a rifle with boar as the primary good reason, then access to land where boar are confirmed will be required to provide that 'good reason'. The FLD will also refer to 13.27 HO Guidance and are unlikely to authorise a chambering less than .270.

    If, as in your case, the FLD are not working to the HO Guidance in it's entirety by ignoring the AOLQ condition, then they will probably cherry pick something from 10.38 and 13.9 and apply it to experienced shooters with 'open' FACs - as has happened.

    For those of us with the AOLQ condition, (especially those with a single AOLQ condition coving all firearms and ammo on the FAC), it's a non-issue as we already have boar included. Thereafter it's up to the FAC holder to make the decision on which rifle/calibre is lawful and/or suitable for which species. This accords nicely with 13.9 of the Guidance:

    "A certificate holder may shoot any quarry that is lawful (where they are authorised to shoot). Whilst guidance is provided, it is the responsibility of the shooter and the shooting community to know what calibre is suitable for which quarry, and when certain quarry is lawful (including the need to obtain or rely upon a licence from the relevant licensing authority to permit the shooting of protected species)."

    From reading some of the threads on here I get the impression that some FAC holders are having issues adjusting to the new found freeedom, (and responsibility!), that the Guidance now gives - probably having difficulty getting away from the micro-management of their use of firearms that had previously been in place. If the FLDs work to the HO Guidance then all should go well, it's only when they start b*st*rdising or ignoring the very workable AOLQ condition that they create problems and extra work for themselves and certificate holders - something that will increasingly be put under the microscope.


    Based on that argument will somebody now ask for wild boar to be added to their .243W ?
    As a standalone application to Glos FLD or their ilk I suspect they'll have kittens and apply 13.27 What do you think?

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