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Thread: Ruger Stutzen Zero queries

  1. #1

    Ruger Stutzen Zero queries

    .308 Ruger M77 Mk2 Stutzen.
    Without going back into the 'Stutzen accuracy' thread, I wonder if some of you can help me out here? Rifle basic trigger fitted- simplicity itself and a big improvement.
    I don't want to get into home loading and am trying various factory loads. Geco 170Gn seems OK, producing just better than 2" c to c at 100yds with a traditional hold ie prone, supported, with one hand gripping the fore end which seems to be he most effective grip.
    I'm thinking I would like better, but I'm shooting at a 1" circle with a 6x42 fixed mag scope (I don't want anything else on this rifle) and with that set up there is also the potential for placement error. I do notice that the vertical error in the groups is minimal (zero to 3/4" depending on the group) but lateral spread is 2" to 2 1/2". What could be the cause of this? Worst with S&B 150gn SPCE rounds which were in a 2 1/2" straight horizontal line!
    I'm waiting 3 mins between shots with the bolt open and 5 mins between gps to let the barrel cool- is that enough?
    Any thoughts guys, especially from the Stutzen gurus (although that may not be relevant!). What could be causing the lateral spread?
    Any other recommended factory ammo I could try?
    p.s does anyone know how to take out the front sight bead? There is a little push down detente, but perhaps it needs a sharp tap forwards as well?
    Thanks for any input.

  2. #2
    Are you shooting for zero off the bags, bipod, or sticks?
    If so, try shooting it out of your hand, holding the forend with your left hand, firmly, to control barrel movement so that you can follow through the shot. You can rest that hand on a bag to steady it. Try to sit up straight, as you would be when shooting in the field. It is important to mount the butt in the same place in your shoulder pocket for each shot, and snug it up consistently, or it will move under recoil and make you string horizontally.

    The front bead slides out. There is a little screw which locks in it place. ( Some have a push button). NECG and Ruger sell different height blades and different styles of them, with different sizes of beads, bars, colors ( brass, black, white, ivory, red ). Recknagel makes some of these for NECG and H&H.
    Last edited by Southern; 21-09-2015 at 16:34.

  3. #3
    Rule out the target could be a simple place to start, with my 6x42 I've found a black cross with red dot in the middle worked well. But that was improved when I found another target the same but had 4 black squares in the quadrants of the cross.

    I've explained that terrible so try this link
    http://www.mytargets.com/target103%2...%20corners.pdf

  4. #4
    Stutzen or not, load testing for accuracy potential would ideally be done with a much higher mag scope to avoid the very aiming errors you refer to and that can be compounded by reticle thickness. Once you’ve found that magic load stick the 6X42 back on.

    The other point to consider is that you may have already realised the maximum accuracy potential of this particular rifle.

    K
    Last edited by Klenchblaize; 21-09-2015 at 16:36.
    The enemy of knowledge is not ignorance, it is the illusion of knowledge.

  5. #5
    Best Target I have found is target2.ashx - simply it is Four One Inch squares - each at a quarter of a larger square - or a large black square with a white cross in the middle. Its then very easy to line up the cross hairs. I have used this for a long time and can shoot well under 1" if I do my bit. Sub 2" with 170 gn bullets out of a lightweight rifle I would be very happy with - go hunting. My 7x65r kicks and I can't shoot well from prone, but a get much better accuracy from shooting standing and fully supported.

    target2.ashx

  6. #6
    A horizontal spread only would suggest it's less the barrel harmonics from the rest taken, and possibly (as said above) more perhaps to do with shoulder placement between shots. Leaving 3 to 5 minutes on an open bolt should be plenty enough for cooling but can you be sure over that time that your shoulder position hasn't moved?

    I'd start with the basics and work your way down a list of possibles. Before I check zero, I always check retainling screws and bolts are tight, the scope rings are firm and that the rear ocullar adjustment is tightened up.

    Next, once in the firing position and the target sighted, the old check of looking away and then looking back seems to work for me as it provides a sure indication of the natural aim point. Even being slightly off here will affect grouping precision.

    Are you using the same trigger pull technique for each shot? If using more than just the first pad on the finger and consciously pulling straight back, there can be a small danger of pulling off a little to one side.

    Finally, for front of the rifle, I'd be tempted to not take too a firm hold, but just enough from the underside to steady the aim and no more. Any overly firm pressure here I've found when shooting a Stutzen design, can have an effect on group precision. I know of some that prefer to place the left hand directly on top of the scope and apply firm pressure down from there. It works for them.

    All that being checked, then it falls down to consistency of cross hair placement which at 100yds for a 6x scope should be possible to shoot off MOA. I can do it with Ruger using a 4 times scope with a fine ret. Higher magnification does help target placement precision though.

    Sorry if the above is granny and eggs, it's not intended that way.

  7. #7
    This is all very useful stuff, thank you for all of it. Targets printed- sure these will help. Shoulder placement advice is very sound I'm sure and I will remember that- not easy to get that consistent shooting prone off old coats! Have now invested in a bench rest (couldn't resist) and will set up from a table and chair (luxury!). I did have a fresh breeze last time so will hope for calm weather this weekend! Will see what other rounds my RFD has also. I'm using a fine ret so that should be OK. Sure I can tweak it down to at least 1 1/2" inches for the satisfaction of it!

    Inspired by some of the Recknagel open sights- perhaps I want top quality open sights on this stutzen......in which case I can move this scope onto something nice like a double s/s in 7x57- now that would be very nice..........

  8. #8
    NECG makes a nice aperture sight which fits onto the rear integral scope base.
    NECG has a calculator on their web site for selecting the best front blade height.
    Brownells also has a good calculator.
    Gun Products Gunsmithing Services | New England Custom Gun Service, Ltd.

    You can set the open sight for 100 yards, and the aperture sight for 200, and fold the leaf sight down.... or just use the aperture sight, set for 50 and 150 zeros, if that suits your hunting situation.

    Warne makes QR rings for the Ruger integral bases. This is the setup I have used on Ruger 77s, and am setting up on the 7x64 I built on an old Ruger tang safety rifle.
    Last edited by Southern; 22-09-2015 at 16:58. Reason: link

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by JMH123 View Post
    This is all very useful stuff, thank you for all of it. Targets printed- sure these will help. Shoulder placement advice is very sound I'm sure and I will remember that- not easy to get that consistent shooting prone off old coats! Have now invested in a bench rest (couldn't resist) and will set up from a table and chair (luxury!). I did have a fresh breeze last time so will hope for calm weather this weekend! Will see what other rounds my RFD has also. I'm using a fine ret so that should be OK. Sure I can tweak it down to at least 1 1/2" inches for the satisfaction of it!

    Inspired by some of the Recknagel open sights- perhaps I want top quality open sights on this stutzen......in which case I can move this scope onto something nice like a double s/s in 7x57- now that would be very nice..........
    A fresh breeze will cause all sorts of problems - a 10mph cross wind will move a bullet a couple of inches at 100 yds and that can easily explain your horizontal separation. You really need to have pretty much zero wind to shoot meaningful tiny groups.

    But in the field if you can keep everything in a four inch circle that will put venison on the table.

  10. #10
    great thread thank you
    Every man is a damn fool for at least five minutes every day; wisdom consists in not exceeding the limit.
    Elbert Hubbard

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