Themal Imaging Spotting Scope 3K Budget

Deutsch - Drahthaar

Well-Known Member
I have decided to take the plunge and buy a thermal imaging scope for spotting deer. I have no experience with these devices so would be grateful for constructive advice on the following questions.

  1. I would like to buy local/UK but if a considerable saving is to be had from overseas then obviously I will make the saving. So what's your experience with buying from abroad and who do you recommend.
  2. I will still be using the binos to confirm that the deer meets the criteria for culling once spotted with the TI. Because of this I'm conscious of carrying too much equipment and them clattering into each other. What's your experience on this and is there a compact pocket sized TI available?
  3. What's the best buy performance wise for 3k and how does warranty/customer care compare between say FLIR and PULSAR.
  4. If I increase to 4K will I see a significant improvement?
  5. Is there anywhere I can try a range of theses devices out and see how they compare with one another and to get a feel of the weight/size & ergonomics.


Regards

DS
 
Pulsar 38 or 50, either are superb bits of kit, try Malmo guns near Lancaster, my local gun shop and second to none imho, speak to John, he deals with that side of things.
 
I'll try to answer each of your questions

1. With the current strength of the pound against the Euro, buying from a European supplier can work out significantly cheaper.
For a Pulsar HD50S, this supplier works out about £200 cheaper than the best price I can find in the UK http://www.jvs-outdoor.com/night-vision-equipment.
You have the same buyers rights in the rest of the EU as in UK so warranty claims should not be an issue.
I purchased a Guide IR518 from a supplier in Belgium a few years ago and had to return it twice for repair.
In each case there were no difficulties associated with the return/repair under warranty process

2. The smallest and easiest to carry imagers are the Guide IR510 and the FLIR Scout series (both use the same case).
The Guide has a poor spec and I would not consider it.
Of the FLIR Scout models, only the LS-XR is worthy of consideration and only then because it is the only imager available with a higher resolution (640x480) sensor.
All of the FLIR models suffer from the fact that they are supplied from the USA and therefore subject to ITAR regulations which limits export models to a refresh rate of 9Hz.
A 9Hz refresh rate has the effect of producing a jerky video image and smearing on the screen when either the imager or the target moves.
It's generally agreed that a 25Hz refresh rate is the minimum required for smooth video performance.
The Pulsar models are slightly larger and heavier than the the FLIR scout, but still small enough to carry in a pocket

3. The best bang for your buck is the Pulsar HD50S. This is the outgoing model and can be had for £2552 from Grahams of Inverness and maybe less from a few others if you want to haggle.
The Pulsar XD50s is the current model, and is around £200 more expensive.
It has no performance advantages over the HD50s - only a few bells and whistles to allow them to charge more for it.
I can't speak for FLIR customer care, but Thomas Jacks are the importers for Pulsar thermals and most people seem to be happy with the way they deal with warranty claims

4. 4k will get you the FLIR Scout LS-XR with it's higher resolution sensor - but low refresh rate and 35mm lens
Detection range is a function of sensor size and resolution and objective lens size
The £4K FLIR has a human detection range of 1140m
The £2.5K Pulsar HD50s -high refresh rate, larger lens (50mm), but lower sensor resolution (384x288), has a human detection range of 1250m

5. Remember that under the distance selling regulations you can get your hands on any (or all) of these and have them for up to 14 days before returning them (in saleable condition) and get a full refund. Other wise, if you're prepared to wait, then I'm sure they will all be on display at the British Shooting Show next February

Hope that helps

Cheers

Bruce
 
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I purchased the Pulsar Quantum 50S from JVS Outdoors (Netherlands) - quick delivery, and excellent after-sales service when the battery magazines required replacement. They also gave me some free extra's worth £100+.

Once you have a thermal you will only use your bino's for tho odd back-up look (i.e is that a Roe buck or a doe??) I now use the Thermal 80% of the time, and bino 20% of the time. It would make sense to downgrade the bino to a smaller compact light model. And yes the bino and thermal will bang against each other, something to be aware of.
 
Once you have a thermal you will only use your bino's for tho odd back-up look (i.e is that a Roe buck or a doe??) I now use the Thermal 80% of the time, and bino 20% of the time. It would make sense to downgrade the bino to a smaller compact light model. And yes the bino and thermal will bang against each other, something to be aware of.

From your field experience with the TI, would you consider that the Pulsar in combination with something like the Swaro CL8x25 bino would be a workable combination for general stalking use?
 
I'll try to answer each of your questions

1. With the current strength of the pound against the Euro, buying from a European supplier can work out significantly cheaper.
For a Pulsar HD50S, this supplier works out about £200 cheaper than the best price I can find in the UK http://www.jvs-outdoor.com/night-vision-equipment.
You have the same buyers rights in the rest of the EU as in UK so warranty claims should not be an issue.
I purchased a Guide IR518 from a supplier in Belgium a few years ago and had to return it twice for repair.
In each case there were no difficulties associated with the return/repair under warranty process

2. The smallest and easiest to carry imagers are the Guide IR510 and the FLIR Scout series (both use the same case).
The Guide has a poor spec and I would not consider it.
Of the FLIR Scout models, only the LS-XR is worthy of consideration and only then because it is the only imager available with a higher resolution (640x480) sensor.
All of the FLIR models suffer from the fact that they are supplied from the USA and therefore subject to ITAR regulations which limits export models to a refresh rate of 9Hz.
A 9Hz refresh rate has the effect of producing a jerky video image and smearing on the screen when either the imager or the target moves.
It's generally agreed that a 25Hz refresh rate is the minimum required for smooth video performance.
The Pulsar models are slightly larger and heavier than the the FLIR scout, but still small enough to carry in a pocket

3. The best bang for your buck is the Pulsar HD50S. This is the outgoing model and can be had for £2552 from Grahams of Inverness and maybe less from a few others if you want to haggle.
The Pulsar XD50s is the current model, and is around £200 more expensive.
It has no performance advantages over the HD50s - only a few bells and whistles to allow them to charge more for it.
I can't speak for FLIR customer care, but Thomas Jacks are the importers for Pulsar thermals and most people seem to be happy with the way they deal with warranty claims

4. 4k will get you the FLIR Scout LS-XR with it's higher resolution sensor - but low refresh rate and 35mm lens
Detection range is a function of sensor size and resolution and objective lens size
The £4K FLIR has a human detection range of 1140m
The £2.5K Pulsar HD50s -high refresh rate, larger lens (50mm), but lower sensor resolution (384x288), has a human detection range of 1250m

5. Remember that under the distance selling regulations you can get your hands on any (or all) of these and have them for up to 14 days before returning them (in saleable condition) and get a full refund. Other wise, if you're prepared to wait, then I'm sure they will all be on display at the British Shooting Show next February

Hope that helps

Cheers

Bruce



How's that thermal scope working out Bruce?

Paul
 
Paul,
Pretty good - 5 or 6 foxes with it so far - had one last night and out again tonight.
It's big brother with the 100mm lens is ready to go, I just need some time and less windy conditions to get it fitted and zeroed.
Hope the leg is improving

Cheers

Bruce
 
Tendon has re attached , I have been zooming bout last two weeks with a moonboot .... But taken off me today , back on own two feet & feeling vulnerable ![emoji52]
Feels tight but hopefully ease off as I go.... Calf muscle atrophied & weak so need to build that up too .... Not bad for 8 weeks tho !

I need to get up to have a play with your toy box again ....
😊😂😂

Folks don't believe me when I tell them what you have !!! & what you've done !

Paul
 
Tendon has re attached , I have been zooming bout last two weeks with a moonboot .... But taken off me today , back on own two feet & feeling vulnerable ![emoji52]
Feels tight but hopefully ease off as I go.... Calf muscle atrophied & weak so need to build that up too .... Not bad for 8 weeks tho !

I need to get up to have a play with your toy box again ....
😊😂😂

Folks don't believe me when I tell them what you have !!! & what you've done !

Paul

Sounds like your recovery is going well - don't do anything daft!!

Shot 3 foxes tonight in a thermal fest
3 of us in the landrover - each with a thermal spotter.
Driver with his Pulsar HD50S, front seat passenger with one of my 640x480 chinese jobs with a 100mm lens, I'm in the back with another chinese 640x480 job with a 75mm lens and I also have my T3 with yet another Chinese 640x480 thermal riflescope with 75mm lens.

Cheers

Bruce
 
Sorry to hijack the OP thread
Another one to consider is the ward wt37 from Clive ward
It's on par with the hd38 but bigger , bulkier but is a lot more robust according to a guy I spoke to who had both it also records

Ward WT37 Thermal Imager Monocular


When I upgrade from the one I have this is what I shall go for. Apparently a lot more robust and warranty is second to none. I've looked through one and quite impressed !:thumb:
 
Great review, having just had a month with the new xt 38 and compared it to a HD 38s I concur extra gizzmos of little practical use. If I was in your position I would go for a HD50s. In good conditions you will see deer at 1,000+yds.

As to how far they will go last year on a cold night passenger airliners at 40,000 ft were clearly visable so truely stunning bits of kit.

D
 
From your field experience with the TI, would you consider that the Pulsar in combination with something like the Swaro CL8x25 bino would be a workable combination for general stalking use?


Have the thermal on a neck-strap so you can access it quick and easy, and a small-ish bino in a large pocket or in a soft case. Which Brand of bino and of what spec is your choice, the issue is if you have both hanging around your neck they will clang against each other, in particular when you climb over a gate or crawl on hands and knees.
One day, of course, advances in technology may well mean a bino/nv/thermal/range finder will all be combined in one compact unit, but maybe not in my life time.
 
When I upgrade from the one I have this is what I shall go for. Apparently a lot more robust and warranty is second to none. I've looked through one and quite impressed !:thumb:

Yeah robustness is important to he , waterproof too & a 1/4" tripod fitting so could mount on a roof mount for a night with a monitor in fro t of car if spotting / driving .
Battery compartment better design & a doddle to change by all accounts ..
Saving my pennies but that will be the one I buy

Paul
 
Yeah robustness is important to he , waterproof too & a 1/4" tripod fitting so could mount on a roof mount for a night with a monitor in fro t of car if spotting / driving .
Battery compartment better design & a doddle to change by all accounts ..
Saving my pennies but that will be the one I buy

Paul


That's two of us saving then :lol:
 
3. The best bang for your buck is the Pulsar HD50S. This is the outgoing model and can be had for £2552 from Grahams of Inverness and maybe less from a few others if you want to haggle.
The Pulsar XD50s is the current model, and is around £200 more expensive.
It has no performance advantages over the HD50s - only a few bells and whistles to allow them to charge more for it.
So no practical performance advantage in the increased refresh rate from 30Hz to 50Hz ?
Thanks
 
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