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Thread: BMH/Hanovarian/HPR Dogs Fasion or Use?

  1. #1

    BMH/Hanovarian/HPR Dogs Fasion or Use?

    Are the new breeds of dog getting more popular (in Britain) because they are fasionable/new or because they actually are so much better than the more "traditional" Labrador/Springer etc.?


    Just for the record I am a fan of Labradors

    "Even at the very bottom of the river, I didn't think to myself, Is this a hearty joke or the merest accident? I just thought, it's wet." - Eeyore

  2. #2
    HPR dogs were originally bred to work on deer, but we are only just catching up with the continentals on how to train them correctly.

    BMH's, in particular, seem to be getting more popular now but I don't think its a fashion thing. I think it is more to do with the breed club getting things organised well and setting up training and tracking days. This then shows what the breed can do and, therefore, gets more people interested in the breed

    I think most dogs can be trained to do most tasks, regardless of their actual breed. It is just easier to train a dog that has been bred for centuries for a particular task. I am sure we have all seen retrievers tracking a deer scent, or a collie retrieving a bird

    Personally, I am a HPR man and like to see dogs doing what they are traditionally bred to do. But in the great scheme of things, be it a Teckle, HPR or a Lab etc, as long as its doing what it enjoys, and doing what its handler wants it to do, who cares?

  3. #3
    Well for me its a fad most dog owners go for what they see working and the Bavairian dogs etc have been made popular by Jan Andrews. She her self has decided to go back to useing labs giving up on the continental single purpous dog. The HPR is differnt all together and will remain popular because of its versatility it is the jack of all trades and for stalking thats what most of us want. The type of HPR is what is more inportant. With regards labs spanials pointers setters etc they will always be popular because they are the best at what they do.

  4. #4
    Well Sam, I think you're off to a bad start because you left off the 'pot stirring' emoticon!

    I suppose there might be some truth in the thought that the pure tracking dogs such as the BMH and Hannoverian have a certain cachet for some people due to their relative rarity value. But it cannot be denied that they excell at what they have been bred to do - track wounded game, period - they are blood trailing breeds. So if that is what you want from a working dog then I suppose you can say that they are 'better', (to use your terminology), at that aspect than 'traditional' English gundog breeds such as ESS & Labrador you have mentioned. Exactly the reverse would apply if you considered a Lab as being 'better' than a BMH for wildfowling/retrieving wouldn't it? The HPR breeds appear to me to offer much value to those who want an 'all-rounder', but as you will have seen from the other threads running on here, there are those who consider that even within the general classification of HPRs there are some breeds that make better trackers/stalking dogs than others due to the general temperement associated with the breed.

    Personally, I believe that all dogs can be trained to be good trackers. Some will be far better than others because the breed has been developed to be more specialised at the task. As a 'fer instance, I would suggest that the average ESS which has been initially trained for rough shooting would be generally speaking too hot for deer stalking. No doubt someone will chime in that they had an ESS that would do it all - mine didn't!

    My dog history thus far has been ESS trained for rough shooting and not used to any great extent extent on deer for the reason already given. Labrador, trained for retrieving wildfowl and game and then deer work - very good but, as someone else has mentioned, trying to please all the time and could overdo that to the detriment of tracking. Teckel, trained for blood trailing, but I found that the delights of going underground were too strong for him. Also a constant battle of wills between us. As I now only want a dog for stalking and wounded game recovery, I have a BHM puppy that I'm bringing on, (all the others were from puppies as well), and I can tell right from the off that his temperament is spot on for me. The trailing ability is already there and I look forward to bringing out the best in him. I'm also considering training him for 'clean boot' competition.

    At the end of the day it all comes down to what suits your requirements and if you and the dog, (of whatever breed you choose), work well together.

    Yours - a fashion victim (apparently)!).
    Last edited by Orion; 18-05-2010 at 12:20.

  5. #5
    I think all dogs can do a good enough job for what most of us need given time and practice. So then it really boils down to fashion. Myself I love HPRs as they just look so athletic.

    ATB Steve

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by Bordersman View Post
    I think all dogs can do a good enough job for what most of us need given time and practice. So then it really boils down to fashion. Myself I love HPRs as they just look so athletic.
    But what are they like on the catwalk?

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Orion View Post
    But what are they like on the catwalk?
    Not seen a cat walk after seeing my Wire hairs!

  8. #8
    Joking aside, my decision to buy a BMH came about by a friend of mine who introduced me to them about 5 years ago. A quiet man, good stalker and a man just getting over throat cancer.

    I have never been infleuenced by Jan Andrews and in my opinion i am bowled over by the BMH breed. In 30 years of stalking I have never had a dog like Todd. Call me stupid but thats my thoughts, and many off this site who have stalked with me and Todd have seen this breed at work and have been amazed. Perhaps I am biased ..................maybe but after many dogs, I can say he is the dog i always wanted.



  9. #9

    I originally bought a vizsla because I wanted a dog I could take out running and did not overheat in the summer in addition to helping retrieve with rough shooting. In the end I got tired of her pointing every hunkered down deer/pheasant in Worcestershire and took up stalking. I was already shooting quite a bit in the military but was never in the same place long enough to get an FAC. About five years ago I was given a bavarian/hannoverian cross as a gift which the viszla is still grumbling about time to time and took an interest in traditional cold blood scenting. I now have quite an extensive library on working these dogs and to be fair its more about companionship and fun then hard arsed blood trailing though they are both good at it.
    Viszlas where bread for hawking and to run with horses, BVH and HS to follow up wounded game that had long since run for cover following a driven hunt. To be honest for UK stalking any steady dog can track given a steady and patient owner.
    Its whatever puts a smile on your face.



  10. #10
    Regardless of what breed of dog you choose, you will get from your dog what you put in when training.

    If your dog has some natural flair and you can build your training round it then you will have a dog that is a pleasure to be with, and a pleasure to take shooting. The people who see your dog working well will remember the day and you.

    In British shooting the labrador and ess have been developed because of their ability to learn well and because our longstanding quarantine laws have prevented european input of other breeds. This has changed radically and we have the benefit of choice as never before.

    Another underated intelligent dog is the standard poodle, originally bred for hunting wolves I'm told, anyone ever trained one ?


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