Have you used thermal yet Willie?
As it happens, yes I have - both through the kindness of a site member here and elsewhere - and very useful it was too. I'll admit, though, that I've not used it a lot.
TBH if I could only come up with suitable justification I'd likely buy a set, as for my type of stalking I'd find it a lot more useful than binos with a built-in rangefinder.
But my argument is not against TI itself, it's against using TI as a substitute for binoculars and then using your riflescope to get visual confirmation of what you are going to shoot in the context of its surroundings.
I wasn't aware this disagreement somehow made the discussion "a car crash"
Where did I advocate target ID, I said sex etc,
I see a deer's sex, age, condition, etc as part of identification, but rather than be pedantic maybe we can settle on "visual confirmation" instead?
You spot the deer...you can tell it's a deer.
Indeed, but the thing about thermal imaging is that the clue is in the name
TI presents you with an image based on thermal energy, not visible light. As you and others have said, TI lets you see lots of things that you can't with binoculars. Of course the opposite is also true - you can see lots of things with binoculars that you can't see with TI. That's why I think the one complements the other, rather than replaces it. The TI manufacturers themselves state that TI does not replace binoculars when it comes to confirming sex, condition, etc.
I don't know about you but much of the woodland stalking I have done you see deer relatively close range, gun on sticks if correct sex , species etc and safe to do so shot taken. If you spot the deer, faffed with bins then gun up the deer would be gone. So why is this different and any less safe.
In my mind it's different and less safe because the shooter is now relying on their riflescope both for the initial visual confirmation of the cull beast and the suitability of its surroundings for a shot to be taken.
So to me rather than:
See the thermal image of the deer - gun on sticks - look through riflescope - gain visual confirmation - take shot
I am suggesting it should be:
See the thermal image of the deer - gain visual confirmation - gun on sticks - look through riflescope - take shot
Of course there are always going to be exceptions where this doesn't happen, but isn't everything on The Stalking Directory the "ideal world scenario"
Oh yes, and in twenty years of stalking and guiding on muntjac and roe I've experienced more than my share of "faffing about"
Is it now impossible to go stalking without bins?
Your ground, your rules - my ground, my rules.
Turn up here to stalk without binoculars and it would be a very short outing indeed. But that's why I carry a spare set in the car, just in case
Thermal imaging is a great tool, but I just don't see it as a replacement for binoculars. Now if you could get binoculars combined with TI......
that really would be something!
PS If anyone locally fancies trying it out then send me a PM it I shall do what I can to help.?
Now that really is a very kind offer