Poisoning in Oxfordshire

Heym SR20

Well-Known Member
Was down at my folks last week and took the dogs for a favourite walk in near by woods along the ridgeway path. There was a notice posted on a tree advising that the posters dogs were seriously ill after eating poisoned bait in the woods.

Its sickening. We lost our last dog to the same poisoning ten years ago, and at the same time several others also lost dogs according to our local vet.

There are a lot of red kites about and you have to ask yourself why somebody is stupid enough to put out poison baits - it's illegal, cruel and does to engender fieldsports and country folk to the wider masses.
 
Agree that it's not the correct thing to do, however, perhaps if we were given the rites to control the population of any species that gets out of control then people wouldn't be driven to doing this sort of thing? There are so many species that I can think of that it's illegal to control for no reason other than it is a bird of prey, it is pretty or a children's story was written about it! Ridiculous!
 
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Is the bait definitely intended for BoP? On a well known footpath (actually a disused railway line that has been paved) near me there has been regular poisoning over the last few years. Each time it's been cocktail sausages stuffed with slug or rat poison. No one seems to be 100% sure who or why they're doing it but it appears that dogs are the one being targeted rather than any other species.
 
Are u sure the posters are correct Heym?
Could it not be somoen just wanting to stir up trouble? Show shooting in a bad light? (is there even a shoot nearby?)

I always find it strange how fellow shooters are often the 1st to jump to conclusions with things like this.

Keepering has changed massively in past 20 or so years and a poisoned BoP is actually pretty uncommon now, sure scottish offical police figures are down to almost single figures most years now.

If someone is putting bait out they should be caught and charged, and it does no good for fieldsports in gneral esp close to footpaths. But they're may be other explantions for it even if poison as i doubt most keepers are stupid enough to do it now
 
The poisoning does not have to be deliberate. A stalker left the gralloch from a fallow 25 metres from my front door. A day or so after my dogs had found it one of them started passing blood with her stools. It was a campylobacter infection and it was touch and go, but she survived after £500 pounds of Vets bills and a week on a drip at the vets. Extremely worrying.

It was just bad practice and thoughtlessness on behalf of the stalker, but the result was just as dangerous as the poisoned bait possibility.

Alan
 
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Well the previous poisoning that got our dog ten years ago was correct - a local gamekeeper ended up in jail for poisoning red kites and his boss fined heavily. And this is in the same place again which just made me sad. Yes it might be somebody trying to stir up trouble, but there is a difference between eating rotten meat and total liver failure from poisoning. Certainly in our case ten years ago our vet was confident it was deliberate poisoning, and seen a number of other local dogs with the same symptoms. Final stage was a cute liver failure and bleeding from every orifice. Not pleasant in the slightest. The description of the symptoms on the poster was pretty much the same.
 
If people keep their dogs on leads walking down The Ridgeway and not letting them run into woods that are private there will not be a problem
 
Definately doesnot sound a nice experience for u or ur dog.
Wot poison did they reckon it was to cause total liver failure and bleeding from every oriffice??
 
Sadly dogs die every year at numerous locations in the country
due to mystery illnesses, poisoning, or picking up viruses, E coli, blue green algae
etc.Often they baffle the experts.
should not always jump to conclusion unless proven.
owners need to watch what their dogs are doing all the time.
 
It doesnt really defend those responsible but you do have a valid point there!

I disagree.

Leaving aside dogs for the moment - and whether the baits were fixed to prevent movement or left so that a BoP, fox, badger or whatever could have moved away from "the woods" - the main problem is one of the poison affecting non-target species.

Look at barn owls, where rodenticide poison has been detected in up to 91% of the population. I doubt anyone is specifically targeting barn owls, but the widespread, permanent and untrained use of these poisons is certainly impacting on non-target species.

On top of that, how does "pet killed by eating poisoned bait left out by gamekeeper in game cover" help shooting exactly?

If it was near the Ridgeway in Oxfordshire there was doubtless a shoot nearby - the shooting is spectacular when the birds come off the top. Numerous of these are large commercial shoots, putting down tens of thousands of birds and tonnes of feed, resulting in millions of rats.

These need to be controlled, but a lackadaisical attitude to poisoning is not the answer. Nor is the view that "if you're dog was on a lead there wouldn't be a problem". Killing non-target species or killing the public's perception of our sport - the result will be the same.

My guess is that we will see either an outright ban, or strict licensing of, the use of poisons. I'm inclined to think "not before time".
 
Not entirely sure ur point willie,

Most of the poisons have been banned for years if not decades, and even if a specific poison is still legal it will be being used outside its conditions, so illegal.
It is 100% illegal to put poison baits out for anything BoP/fox and has been for years. Any keeper who does should feel the full weight of law.
Poisons are already stricctly licensed even now u need a licence/training to stick decnt rat poison out which has just changed this year.

But just because something may be poisoned does not mean a keeper has done it, dogs may all of found a puddle that has had anti freeze leaked into it, slug pellets spilled somewhere, even around someone's garden (even someone who doesnae like all the dog poo/people walking past front of house?)
Very easy to just lazily point finger at keepers, get enough of that from other side without doing it oursleves, unless there is some evidence
 
Very easy to just lazily point finger at keepers, get enough of that from other side without doing it oursleves, unless there is some evidence

I am not "lazily point finger at keepers". But neither am I sticking my head in the sand and pretending every keeper is perfect and the antis make it all up. Look at the evidence, look at the impact on non-target species, look at the adverse publicity.

We talk about how shooting helps conservation, which it does, but until some of the practices and attitudes that we try to brush under the carpet are recognised for what they are we are undermining our own position.

If we are not honest enough to admit these things go on, then we only have ourselves to blame when our sports get banned.

Keepers, shoot managers, landowners and game shooters need to realise we are living on borrowed time.
 
We talk about how shooting helps conservation, which it does, but until some of the practices and attitudes that we try to brush under the carpet are recognised for what they are we are undermining our own position.

If we are not honest enough to admit these things go on, then we only have ourselves to blame when our sports get banned.

Keepers, shoot managers, landowners and game shooters need to realise we are living on borrowed time.

Spot on, Willie.
 
Sounds like Warfarin to me, Sir?

Cheers old man, never used warafin or needed do do much rat poisoning. But that makes sense as used for thinning blood in humans.

So if that was the case it may not have been the keeper at all (althou it still could be) but could be almost anyone who poisons rats, possibly even OP? or nieghbours, and the baits have been misplaced/dragged out to be exposed to non targets. Not sure if chewing a dead one would be enough?? But i'd imagine not so must have chewed on a bait station (possibly another argument for keeping a dog on a lead, would not of had the oportunity to eat enough?)
But obviously u'll never truely know without a PM

Ur talking about a very different scenario to baits scattered all over to kill other things illegally.


Willie i know very well wot goes on but that attitudes ur on about have changed massively in the last 30 or so years (even thou the law hasn't really) or atleast they have in the areas i know well. Confirmed BoP kills in scotland is down to almost single figures now, the 'conservationists' feed station will have killed more BoP's in scotland than keepers recently!!

It now really is the tiny minority and getting smaller all the time.
But i'm just surprised how quick fellow field sportsmen are to believe the worst and all the spin put out by the anti's


I really feel for the OP,must be a terrible way to lose a pet, but there is many other far more likely ways for ur dog to pick up poison in the countryside
 
Countrryboy very little warfarin is used in pest control now mainly the far stronger 2nd gen even with these alot of dead animals would need to be eaten to cause any sort of external signs, the earlier post about barns owls proves it getting miss used but the test are normally carried out on RTA. Warfarin is probably going to start getting used more in the future it breaks down in the environment in days compared to weeks for 2nd gen
Jake
 
.Willie i know very well wot goes on but that attitudes ur on about have changed massively in the last 30 or so years (even thou the law hasn't really) or atleast they have in the areas i know well. Confirmed BoP kills in scotland is down to almost single figures now, the 'conservationists' feed station will have killed more BoP's in scotland than keepers recently!!

It now really is the tiny minority and getting smaller all the time.
But i'm just surprised how quick fellow field sportsmen are to believe the worst and all the spin put out by the anti's.

I do agree that attitudes have changed, some for the better, some not.

The days of "old velveteens" walking the estate and shooting anything with a hooked bill are, I agree, largely gone. There are a lot of enlightened young (and old) keepers around who are thinking much more about quality rather than quantity. I've now visited a couple of wild pheasant and English partridge shoots that are not just inspirational but truly beacons for conservation.

However I also see attitudes that are not so good, particularly related to the rise of commercial shoots, where days sold during the season are a way not just of subsidising the "family shoot" but rather a major source of income. In that situation the pressure to guarantee numbers can become excessive, and I have no doubt this results in laws being bent if not broken.

Personally I can see the push for 'vicarious liability' laws, something I'm finding increasingly hard to argue against.

I truly hope persecution of BoP is a thing of the past, as it has no place in today's world. Of course hand-in-hand we should also have the opportunity to remove/re-locate BoP where numbers become excessive - go along the Ridgeway and count the numbers of buzzards and kites and you'll soon lose the will to live!
 
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