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Thread: Firearms licence format (physical)

  1. #1

    Firearms licence format (physical)

    Perhaps if an electronic system could be adopted (like an identity card) and we didn't need to carry about peices of ever decaying paper. A friend of mine writes the software for the back-office and the chips in the cards and says it should be simple enough to come up with a card that we present into a reader at the RFD's and all of our details (photo, what we can and can't purchase/own) can be viewed and updated there and then. A lot les complex than an Oyster or bank card (as there is no money involved).

    Thoughts ?

  2. #2
    Quote Originally Posted by Leadwasp View Post
    I hope you don't mean an a universal identity card!!!! In no uncertain terms that form of identity card will forever fundamentally shift the relationship between the state and it's citizens. At the moment IT answers to YOU. An ID card will turn the tables.

    Nonetheless a tech solution to just a firearms license isn't always the best solution. Easily lost, you'd still have to send it away for it to be 'edited', can be copied far more easily than paper unless you use proprietary technology which raises price, might be casually interrogated, could be erased................................like a chip and pin card if sat on it's knackered unlike a paper license which as long as it's not seriously damaged is still useable.
    Yeah, like an identity card. The card doesn't really have much on it though, just a link to a FELD database, pop in the card, up comes your details which are on the police computer. Exactly the same details that are on your FAC, SGC etc. The first thing to be shown is your mugshot. Instantly identifying you as you. Then the rest of the info. If you buy ammo the RFD simply enters it onto the database. The card is an identity check, The RFD can see what entitlements you have and will update the central database accordingly. You could have 2 cards if you wanted, all that the card has in its chip is your ID number.

    If you purchase or dispose of a firearm/shotgun the RFD updates the database.
    No need to send letters in
    No paper handling.
    Instant update.
    Only the FELD can make changes - which can be done instantly.
    The FELD (and only the FELD) would have access to your private information - which they have already anyway.
    Reduced costs all round.

    3 levels of access
    (1) you can login and see what you have
    (2) the RFD can log in and add ammo purchase, gun purchase etc
    (3) the FELD can create and edit as required
    Last edited by Miki; 06-12-2016 at 22:22.

  3. #3
    All well and good until the computer he says 'no'. I have suffered at least a fortnight's delay in addition to the six weeks already for a one to one variation because, I have been told, the computer has a software problem that prevents it printing the conditions on a certificate.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Shootist View Post
    All well and good until the computer he says 'no'. I have suffered at least a fortnight's delay in addition to the six weeks already for a one to one variation because, I have been told, the computer has a software problem that prevents it printing the conditions on a certificate.
    No need to print anything. Just login and there it is, only the FELD can add entitlements/conditions, the RFD's can add purchases/transfers. You can look at it and print it off if you really wanted to... As soon as the database is updated its done, no need to wait for a bit of paper to arrive in the post. Like a tax disc ..... redunadant in this day and age.

  5. #5
    But that is just it!, it's TOO simple for them, it is obvious it couldn't be ever tinkered with by those less knowledgable staff, Just look at the savings in time & money caused by such a system.
    (The Unspeakable In Pursuit Of The Uneatable.) " If I can help, I will help!." Former S.A.C.S. member!

  6. #6
    just thinking out loud, please dont shoot me down in flames! - never done this but just wondered. what if my mate has same caliber rifle and runs out of ammo, can i transfer some of my ammo to his ticket? if so, how would that work with our theoretical 'card' system if the holder only has 'read only' access


    edit: just remembered the sec5 ammo rules are being changed, kinda makes my thought irrelevant.....
    Last edited by disco2; 07-12-2016 at 09:59.

  7. #7
    I needs to be remembered that the object of firearms licensing, as far as many police forces are concerned, is to place as many obstructions as possible in the way of firearms ownership. It will only be changed (and not necessarily improved in those changes) when the change is less onerous than messing firearms owners around as much as possible. How many practices and policies are complied with in the certain knowledge they are utterly pointless? The people making these policies are either utterly stupid, a possibility I will allow, or far more likely doing everything they can to make life a PITA for shooters.

    By way of example, S.1 firearms could easily be licensed in the same manner as S.2 shotguns, with only a few conditions extra. Easy peasy. It's unlikely ever to happen.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by disco2 View Post
    just thinking out loud, please dont shoot me down in flames! - never done this but just wondered. what if my mate has same caliber rifle and runs out of ammo, can i transfer some of my ammo to his ticket? if so, how would that work with our theoretical 'card' system if the holder only has 'read only' access


    edit: just remembered the sec5 ammo rules are being changed, kinda makes my thought irrelevant.....
    Giving that some thought, perhaps sensible laws would just allow you to give the ammunition. You have moved them on, it seems to matter not whether your shot them all, which you do not need to record, or gave them to a licensed person, they're gone. The licensed person is allowed to possess them so no problem there. If he had made them up himself reloading then he would not need to record that fact but he has gained ammunition.

    Dear God! I've just realised, if some Firearms Licensing Officer somewhere reads this we will all have to start recording when and where we have shot our ammunition.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by disco2 View Post
    just thinking out loud, please dont shoot me down in flames! - never done this but just wondered. what if my mate has same caliber rifle and runs out of ammo, can i transfer some of my ammo to his ticket? if so, how would that work with our theoretical 'card' system if the holder only has 'read only' access
    .
    The onus is upon us (as FAC holders) to not hold more ammunition than is authorised and only to transfer/sell firearms and ammunition to others who have permission. Strictly you must also inform the Cheif Officer of Police/your issuing authority (FELD) within 7 days (in writing by fax or eMail) if you do make any transfer, which must be made 'in person'.

    If you gave your mate a box then that's up to you, if you sell him a box that's up to you too, if you did this on a regular/commercial basis then you need an RFD licence to "sell" ammunition legally. Just be sensible about it and you can carry on. With our 'theroretical' card system, every time you buy ammunition from an RFD the transaction would be noted and your entilment checked and updated.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Shootist View Post
    Dear God! I've just realised, if some Firearms Licensing Officer somewhere reads this we will all have to start recording when and where we have shot our ammunition.
    No, I can't see that happening, but if you have a firearm and you don't buy any ammunition, then they will question why you have a gun at all. And if you buy thousands of rounds that may raise eyebrows too !

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