help required for a friend

centralbeltstalker

Well-Known Member
Tibial plateau leveling osteotomy

simple terms TPLO.

guys help required, mate has a Japanese akita dog just diagnosed with the above.
he has been told it will cost £2500 to fix and put right.
Does anyone here know a vet with mates rates etc.
He has asked the PDSA to help but no is the short answer...

any help appreciated as the likely outcome may be putting the dog down.

thanks in advance frank
 
That is an operation to correct a ruptured anterior cruciate ligament. It is the gold standard of treatment for this injury in a heavy built dog. It requires a lot of prep work-x-rays etc and specialist kit to do but the results are very good although the dog will need months of careful management. There are other cheaper but now out of date methods of achieving joint stability ie "over the top" grafts but they went out of use when TPLO invented. As it is a complicated job, really for a specialist in orthopedics , I doubt any chance of mates rates. Shop around if you wish but John Ferguson used to be the man for this job. No wonder PDSA not forthcoming. If someone can afford an Akita they perhaps dont qualify for charity help. David
 
Frank

Whilst not wishing to appear harsh. Having an unsound animal put to sleep is often the best policy. Just because you can surgically correct the damage doesn't always mean that you should. I agree 100% with the PDSA's decision.

The success rate of this procedure is dependent upon many factors, age, bred, post operative care, intended post op activity rates, etc. Its not a job for your local vets ether so not a chance of a mates rate op.
 
That is an operation to correct a ruptured anterior cruciate ligament. It is the gold standard of treatment for this injury in a heavy built dog. It requires a lot of prep work-x-rays etc and specialist kit to do but the results are very good although the dog will need months of careful management. There are other cheaper but now out of date methods of achieving joint stability ie "over the top" grafts but they went out of use when TPLO invented. As it is a complicated job, really for a specialist in orthopedics , I doubt any chance of mates rates. Shop around if you wish but John Ferguson used to be the man for this job. No wonder PDSA not forthcoming. If someone can afford an Akita they perhaps dont qualify for charity help. David

sound advice mate will pass on
 
Frank

Whilst not wishing to appear harsh. Having an unsound animal put to sleep is often the best policy. Just because you can surgically correct the damage doesn't always mean that you should. I agree 100% with the PDSA's decision.

The success rate of this procedure is dependent upon many factors, age, bred, post operative care, intended post op activity rates, etc. Its not a job for your local vets ether so not a chance of a mates rate op.

as before mate sound advice, all i can do is pass it on. he loves the dog but just aint got that kinda cash... shame and thanks for the honest reply
 
Frank, I've not got anything constructive to add accept to send your friend best wishes at what is no doubt a difficult time. JC
 
Would it be worth an enquiry with one of the veterinary universities, such as Liverpool, as maybe a teaching op? bit of a shot in the dark I know, but if you don't ask , you certainly won't get.
 
as before mate sound advice, all i can do is pass it on. he loves the dog but just aint got that kinda cash... shame and thanks for the honest reply

Frank

Many a vet has been made extremely wealthy, thanks to those pet owners who just can't face the financial and emotional realities of the situations they find themselves having to deal with when their animals requires care and attention.

Very often the cost of replacement is far lower than the cost of treatment/surgery, post op care and rehabilitation. Whilst not advocating the adoption of throw away pet ownership. The old RSPCA "A dog is for life not just for Christmas" campaign slogan has a lot to answer for in regards the mind set of your average cuddly and cute pet owner.
 
Frank, If it comes down to euthanasia or op and a TPLO is out of reach costwise i am pretty sure you will be able to find a vet who still does the old graft type repairs. Not all vets have been able to invest in the kit or pay for the training to do TPLOs .

Ravi most vets every day have to juggle owner expectation, affordability, clinical expectation, quality of life and all the rest when making judgements. Very few in my experience take into account what they will make out of it as an influence in their decisions. Farm vets always have to take the commercial worth of their patient into account but thankfully most pet owners have more attachment to their animals. David
 
My springer bitch had a similar op done at 6 mths having just come in from the garden limping one day. We still don't know how an otherwise very heathy pup did this. However, she made a very full recovery and is now a very happy 6 year old.

Thankfully, we were insured and the premium won't lapse ever again. Total cost of treatment was around the £3500 mark at the time.

Interestingly, there was a programme on the TV about a week ago showing this being done (to a police Springer i think).
 
Frank,

I know we are talking about a dog here, but I have known several people in recent years who have had some of the top surgeons perform ACL reconstructions, linked with sports injuries mostly rugby, although some have recovered to play again, after about 12 months rehabilitation if not more, a few have been told they will never be able to play sport again... I would suggest the biggest issue in this instance is the rehabilitation which is hard to manage for a human let alone with a dog...

I wish your friend and the dog all the best, but its a lot of money and i fear it may never be the same life for the dog in the future as it was so maybe the kinder option is the other... Hope this helps to his decision, i difficult times...

ATB

Alex
 
My ESS bitch developed this problem a few years back when she was around 3 yr old. The 1st op (unsuccesful) was to reset the ligament back onto the bone in a slightly different position to the original point. The vet did tell me that there was no 'guaranteed fix'. Very much trial and error and hope for the best !

6 months later she was limping again, so back to the vet. 2nd op was to deepen the groove in the bone where the ligament passes over it. (Don't ask me the names etc because I'm no expert) This op was a great success and she's had no problems since :D:D:D

Vet's bills were £500 for each op. (not insured) :doh: and I was told it was very much a standard procedure so I would certainly shop around.

Apparently, there is no definitive cause and is probably down to genetics as some animals are prone to the problem. (So don't use her for breeding because she'll just pass on the bad gene)

With regards to 'throw away' dogs etc I think it is down to the owner's personal preference. If it's a young animal with excellent working pedigree then at least give it a try, if she/he is past their prime then do what is best for the animal.

Rocky
 
hi everyone,

i will call him and give him the regards from those whom posted them and let him know what you and i agree is best. Fb i think the school idea is a good one mate thanks.


many thanks to all who posted everyone a good one, thanks guys.

will let bill know and get back to you

frank
 
Frank

Contact the Dick Vet in Edinburgh. I have heard of them often carrying out unusual procedures at reduced costs simply for the experience and training. I would doubt if there would be issues re them not having the equipment etc. They are situated I think in Summerhall off Sciennes, near the Meadows.

I ruptured my ACL playing football 20 years ago. Got the same repair as Gazza. Spent 1 year off work at physio every day Mon-Fri for almost the whole year. Returned to work in the following May, ruptured the repair playing rugby in the August, yes.... what a ****! However, I have managed without one simply by keeping the legs strong etc. I was told 18 months for the tissue to repair after the op. Must be a similar recovery time for a dog.

Good luck with above.
 
Frank tell your mate to call Davie Scott at McKenzie,Bryson & Marshall, Beith or Kilmarnock surgeries one of the most talented hands Ive every watched ,this man really knows his stuff theres nothing I seen or heard him walk away from ,tell your mate to let the vets make there own diagnosis vets tend not to like ,to know your going round everyone looking for a bargain .

Theres always Glasgow Vet School the best in the world as Morena on here will tell you his own school many moons ago .
 
Ravi most vets every day have to juggle owner expectation, affordability, clinical expectation, quality of life and all the rest when making judgements. Very few in my experience take into account what they will make out of it as an influence in their decisions. Farm vets always have to take the commercial worth of their patient into account but thankfully most pet owners have more attachment to their animals. David
David

Don't get me wrong the veterinary profession has always been one I have admired. But at the end of the day they are all in commercial businesses not charities.

I also know what the gross margins are. ;)

Large animal work other than equine has always been the tougher end of the money making equation when compared to small animal work. That so often exploted owners attatchment to their pets is what makes small animal work so lucrative along with the increasing number of urban pet owners paying out for pet insurance.
 
As to suggesting Blue cross etc. They seem only to be interested in the big cities. Get out of them and you can go whistle. This is from experience. We got lumbered with two untrained dogs whilst a rather nasty divorce is going on. One never got home as it bolted from the car when we stopped to pick up a collar. Yep never even had collars for them. Short version is this Saluki cross was running all day until it got walloped by a car and has cost us nigh on £900 to save it's rear foot. The insurance they she claimed to have was non exisitant and Blue Cross were not interested. We live off the pension and a bit of carers allowance so it was hard. The dog is now fine and we are a lot poorer.

I am wary of a lot of pet insurances having been scalped by them in the past. My old Staffie walk in something, we don't know what but it must have been a chemical as it caused the skin on the pads to peel off. vet treatment was called for and was on going for some 8 months. I made a claim they paid for three vet visits then refused to apy. the vet got onto them pointign outt hsi was on going treatment for the same injury and they paid some of it. the changed the premiums and excess. the premiums trebled and the excess was set at £45 just enough back then to cover this treatment so they didn't have to pay out. About a year or so after I told them to stuff it they phoned up trying to get me to rejoin their scheme. i told them exactly what I thought of them and the chap on the phone say :-

" oh no we would never do that!"

I still have the papers in the filing cabinet. Friends had similar problems with the equines policy they ended up suing tog et the bills paid that were covered by their policy.

Once bitten twice shy!
 
I'll take this opportunity to give Direct Line Pet insurance thier daily slagging off from me to anyone who will listen!

DON'T USE DIRECT LINE!!!!

Thank you for listening,
JC
 
I'll take this opportunity to give Direct Line Pet insurance thier daily slagging off from me to anyone who will listen!

DON'T USE DIRECT LINE!!!!

Thank you for listening,
JC

noted jc as too was the other one on the insurance post. mental note dont cross you, you dont give up ha ha
 
cruciate ligament

hi mate i once took a good dog to a vet with this problem i was told that it needed an op and it would cost £450.00 i was gutted i decided to go away and have a think i rang a well known dog trainer and he said to get a second opinion the first vet charged consultation and gave some painkillers iwent to another vet and told him what had gone on after looking at my dog he said it should have anti inflamitaries not painkillers and rest and didnt need operating on after this my dog was fine im always cautious now
 
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