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Thread: 8.5x63 = 338-06 ?

  1. #1
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    8.5x63 = 338-06 ?

    Does anyone know if the continental calibre 8.5x63 is actually .338-06? or .338-06AI?.... or not.

  2. #2
    Basically yes. I have heard of it, but never seen one. On paper it would seem to be a great round for pigs and driven game.

    I cut and pasted this:

    "Designed by Werner Reb the 8.5x63 Reb is based on the 30-06 case necked up to .338” (8.5mm), similar to the 338-06. However, the Reb round has the shoulder pushed forward in an Ackley-style, which offers more capacity and lower pressures than the original 338."

    Edited to add: I assume the shoulder change is for safety purposes as much as anything, as it would prevent the round chambering in a 30/06, 7x64 and other similar rifles.
    Last edited by Claret_Dabbler; 22-10-2010 at 14:16.
    Brian.

    Just because you are paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you......

  3. #3
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    "8.5x63 Reb"....(duly noted) Thanks Brian.

    We (my son and I) were thinking about maybe getting a 9.3x62 for heavy and driven game but we're liking the sound of this calibre a little better. Those .338 bullets do seem to have excellent ballistics and the Americans make lots of them so they shouldn't cost too much either. Actually, we already have one .30-06 and maybe we should just get another one, but you know how flights of fancy take you.

  4. #4
    Have to say I find the 338/06 a very attractive option, on paper at least, the 35 Whelan also.

    In reality, the 30/06 loaded slowish (2400 - 2500fps?) with a soft round nosed 200 or 220gr bullet would have just the same effect, and give you and me less grief with the local constabulary.
    Brian.

    Just because you are paranoid, doesn't mean they aren't out to get you......

  5. #5
    Check out Herr Reb's own website -www.werner-reb.de. Of course it is in German but if you Google it you can use the translation tool to get a (quaint!) translation. Look under meine patronen for the 8.5x63 - there are rimmed (R) and rimless versions. There are also his other rounds there too- several rimmed catridges and a 6.5 version of the old 270 winchester which might be of interest to the British stalker but of course it is basically a wildcat so you'd have to load your own.

    8.5 x63 seems to be available from one or two german ammo makers .

  6. #6
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    Quote Originally Posted by RoyalTW View Post
    Check out Herr Reb's own website -www.werner-reb.de. Of course it is in German but if you Google it you can use the translation tool to get a (quaint!) translation. Look under meine patronen for the 8.5x63 - there are rimmed (R) and rimless versions. There are also his other rounds there too- several rimmed catridges and a 6.5 version of the old 270 winchester which might be of interest to the British stalker but of course it is basically a wildcat so you'd have to load your own.

    8.5 x63 seems to be available from one or two german ammo makers .
    Hmm, 6.5-.270, much the same as 6.5-06 I'd imagine. I use the 6.5-.284, same case capacity and internal surface area again, but in a shorter cartridge.

    Thanks for the link, though.

  7. #7
    It is Werner Reb's own design. I know that neither 338-06 Ackley Improved, nor the 338-06 will fit usually in the chamber. He used the 270 and blew it out. The 8.5x63 R is a 7x65R necked out.

    Nice guy Werner Reb, and very knowledgeable about his scope of firearms. Blaser, Sauer, and Mauser all make rifles in these calibers.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Claret_Dabbler View Post
    Basically yes. I have heard of it, but never seen one. On paper it would seem to be a great round for pigs and driven game.

    I cut and pasted this:

    "Designed by Werner Reb the 8.5x63 Reb is based on the 30-06 case necked up to .338” (8.5mm), similar to the 338-06. However, the Reb round has the shoulder pushed forward in an Ackley-style, which offers more capacity and lower pressures than the original 338."

    Edited to add: I assume the shoulder change is for safety purposes as much as anything, as it would prevent the round chambering in a 30/06, 7x64 and other similar rifles.
    The .338" bullet would prevent chambering, but that aside, I believe the shoulder change facilitates m0re substantial headspacing. It gets to the point where there is darned little shoulder left if you don't.~Muir

  9. #9
    The .338" bullet would prevent chambering,
    Eggzackly.

    Headspacing ceased to be ANY sort of "safety" issue when bullet manufacturers quit making balloon cases and started deflecting "escaping" gases away from the rear of the action on bolt-action firearms. I know it goes against all the "expert" gun writing (ptooey), but with precious few exceptions, the ONLY realistic "issue" with regard to headspacing is case life, and that is COMPLETELY mitigated by proper resizing die setup. On the "Dark" side of the issue, the headspace boogeyman gives gunwriters more non-sense to pontificate about; gunsmiths a way to make money off of non-sense; and ne'er-do-wells a way to steal quality firearms from widows and the unitiated.

    I'm sure there is a small 'low pressure' zone over northern Europe at the moment due to all the gasps at such "dangerous" heresy. However, give the following a little thought before you rise to 'set right' the above heresy: If "excessive" headspace is such a "dangerous" thing, how is it we don't kill and maim people, and destroy firearms right and left with all the people fire-forming their cases in non-standard chambers? Fire-forming headspace can easily exceed the "expert's recommendations" on "safe" headspace by 50-fold when fire-forming.

    "Excessive headspace" is a boogeyman in any firearm made after 1896. If ANYONE tells you that your "modern" rifle has "excessive" headspace and it needs/requires "work", he's: 1) trying to steal your money, or 2) steal your firearm, or 3) "doesn't have a clue", or 4) all of the above. In my opinion, there is no greater silliness perpetrated on the firearms and hunting communities than the balderdash surrounding "excessive headspace".

    And just so I'm not misunderstood, I AM NOT taking Muir to task over headspacing. I am in total agreement with all of his post. I fully understand that he didn't say that headspacing would be 'dangerous'. Rather he was just commenting on the headspacing challenge of 'snake hips'. The .35 Whelen even more so.

    On topic... The .338-06 or the 8.5x63 - Ackley'd or not - is an excellent cartridge. Barnes used to sell a 165-grain bullet in .338, but I don't think they do anymore. With the advent of the .338 Federal CARTRIDGE (AKA .338-08), there may be some more development of light-for-caliber bullets in the .338 CALIBER. I've gotten tired of waiting for bullet manufacturer's marketing divisions to recognize the obvious. I have simply started making my own bullets. As with casting bullets, once set up for swaging jacketed bullets, it's not only 'easy', it's every bit as satisfying as casting them.

    Another excellent cartridge is the 8mm-06, as is the 8mm-08.

    Regards
    Paul

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Claret_Dabbler View Post
    Have to say I find the 338/06 a very attractive option, on paper at least, the 35 Whelan also.

    In reality, the 30/06 loaded slowish (2400 - 2500fps?) with a soft round nosed 200 or 220gr bullet would have just the same effect, and give you and me less grief with the local constabulary.
    From casting around t'interweb, the 35 Whelan is popular in France for boar, seemingly quite often in Pump or Semi-Auto guise.

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