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Thread: primers

  1. #1

    primers

    What are the most commonly used primers in reloading recipes that would cover loading? in (.223rem one in eight and .234win one in ten twist) as this is all i wish to load lots of talk of loads and bullets but nothing much about primers, i believe some primers produce more gas how would this affect overall load in the cartridge, only want to use one primer in both reloads as the gun shops around here don't stock a great deal in primer! any information would be welcome thank you.

  2. #2
    You're right, different primers can produce different results, but if you just buy the brand that's locally avilable to you and stick to that one brand, you'll not experience any variation. I've never experienced any brand of primer being more suitable than another for a given cartridge.
    You can't say muntjac without saying, Mmmmmm.

  3. #3
    I'm not sure that someone could be so good that their results on paper could be differentiated based on primer choice alone..... I'm quite happy when my reload goes pop to be fair

  4. #4
    I used to use the same primer over three calibers ,You should check the reload information regarding your cartridges as you may find a different primer is required ,Powder and primer combinations vary from different caliber families ,
    Trying different primers is done in your load developements stage were you are looking for the link , powder bullet type and weight and primer, When the round consistancy has been developed you could substitute a different primer and try it against known results.
    I found where Federal 210m and CCI produced the same results , It has been difficult at times to buy one or the other so I buy in bulk (1000) when needed .
    Also I reload in batches with the same primer so it maintains the same batch consistancy.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by quiteman View Post
    What are the most commonly used primers in reloading recipes that would cover loading? in (.223rem one in eight and .234win one in ten twist) as this is all i wish to load lots of talk of loads and bullets but nothing much about primers, i believe some primers produce more gas how would this affect overall load in the cartridge, only want to use one primer in both reloads as the gun shops around here don't stock a great deal in primer! any information would be welcome thank you.
    I may be interpreting this wrongly, but you do know that they are two different sizes of primer, right? Large Rifle and Small Rifle. Twist rate is of no direct consequence with regard to priming.

    I have found that there is no perfect primer -meaning that one could be judged superior for a given load ahead of time. Priming does make a difference and sometimes you need to experiment a little. I have a 7x57 that I love to shoot. With 4831 and a 145 grain Spitzer, launched by a Remington #9.5 primer, it would shoot clover-leaf groups. One afternoon I ran out of Remington Primers and loaded CCI. My groups went to 1- 1.5" and better. The next day I returned to Remington 9.5's and the groups were back where I had expected them to be. I couldn't believe that the grouping could be affected so much so I repeated the process. Again, the groups went to 1.5". I then repeated the process using a different LOT of CCI primers. Same results. This went on for a month. Thirty five years later I still feed Remingtons to that Mauser. That doesn't mean that CCI are bad. It was just a preference. In 22 Hornet I have switched to small pistol primers because they shrunk groups.

    I would try what is available and then choose. You won't be able to make an informed choice away from the range. JMHO ~Muir

  6. #6
    Hi to all.
    Thank you all for your input to someone new to reloading what i was trying to do was only use one primer of same make large and small to load both but thought i would not get away that easy without trying different primers, did not think it would make a lot of differents but from what Muir has said it will and i would like my ammo to give good groups when shooting.
    Thanks all : Chris

  7. #7
    Good evening gents. The question of different primers is one that always comes up .This is what we have found through extensive testing.
    Primers , of different make and levels of briscence( the intensity of burn and level of flash produced) can have a huge effect on both accuracy and consistency of a given laod.we hve found that when we have finaly arrived at a rifles load in terms of powder charge / bullet weight and style /seating depth . we can further tune the performance by running a primer scan. tThat is for example a 308 is run with a seven group test with cci br2, cci 200, cci 250 magnum , remington 91/2, remington 91/2m , federeal 210m and federal 215m. Shot side by side on a seven aim point target all on the same sheet and taking very carefull note of the chrono figures one can very quickly deduce and compare preformance and demonstrate which is the primer best suited to the given powder /bullet/ case combination used.
    we have ofund that when a rifle double groups ie. three shots together and two shots spaced away from those three but together it is normaly indicative of an incosistent ignition cyclae and a change of primer is called for. This is a conclusion reached through a great deal of testing and tuning of rifles and by the correlation of the obtained data
    I hope this wil be of help Rspectfully Mike Norris Brock and Norris Custom Rifles

  8. #8
    Have you made sure that you have eliminated manufacturing inconsistencies in the brass before these tests? I have run similar tests, recorded the results, but then taken the repeated the same tests but first assuring that the primer pocket is uniform, flash hole of a consistent diameter, and no burrs in in the powder area. There was a marked difference in performance: Not that inappropriate /ill suited powder and primer combinations were suddenly working perfectly, but a measurable improvement. Any experiences along those lines, Mike?~Muir
    Last edited by Muir; 30-01-2011 at 02:45.

  9. #9
    There is a primer heat chart below the powder data on this link.
    Burn Rates

  10. #10
    But the man writes that it was developed by "totally unscientific" methods, based upon his observations. Primers, in my opinion, are best matched the powder when it comes to determining performance. There is no "best" primer. The results can be surprising.

    In 1988 I made up a test "barrel" in 30-06 that was machined with just a chamber and nothing else. The barrel stub ended ahead of the chamber. This was fitted to a Model 98 Mauser action. Resting squarely against the machined face of the barrel was a machined 4" long rod of equal diameter (2") to the barrel face, which was mounted on a hinged rod, and that to a frame work with a pivot pin. Kind of a ballistic pendulum affair. Attached to the outboard end was a marker from a commercial tracking thermometer that would mark movement of the pendulum on a radially marked graph paper. The idea was that I would fire primers in the "gun" which would cause the pendulum to swing to differing degrees which would be indicated and recorded on the graph paper.

    The test case was a single Lake City case which had the pocket reamed for uniformity and depth and the burrs removed. It was then fit to the chamber by fire forming using a dry cereal filler. (During the tests this fire forming needed to be repeated several times due to shortening of the case/headspace)

    It took me a couple of weeks of spare time to machine and build this unit and this is what I found: Magnum primers all were about the same, Standard large rifle primers were about the same with regard to average pendulum movement. The difference came when you looked at the spread. Match primers were the most uniform, generally, and non-match were not. About what you'd expect. Oddly, some of the primers I rated as mediocre were the ones I used for my most accurate 500M silhouette loads.

    After much thought I decided that there is much more to it than "heat" of the primer. Especially since the "heat" is retarded/utilized by the coatings on the powder to achieve different burn rates and in doing so, influence the pressures. While some powders seem to require a certain primer (I wouldn't touch off 5010 machinegun powder with a small pistol primer) there seems to be a need to mate the primer to the powder and cartridge. My most recent example is my Hornet load. With small rifle primers the loads are good. With small pistol primers the groups were cut in half and the velocities higher. I have my own ideas as to why but I'll sit on them for now.

    For now, since we can't control the uniformity of the primers we buy, we as shooter might concentrate on the uniformity of the primer pockets we use them in. It's one of the few accuracy enhancements (to a cartridge case) that I think is worth while in a sporting rifle.~Muir
    Last edited by Muir; 30-01-2011 at 14:11.

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