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Thread: Unproductive land - any comeback?

  1. #1

    Unproductive land - any comeback?

    As a relative newcomer to stalking I managed to get in on a very small informal syndicate towards the beginning of the last Fallow season on a relatively small parcel of land that I (via a small detour) pass nearly daily.

    Having met with the chap who runs it, he informed me that it was actually very rare not to see deer on the land (arable farm bordering woodland), even during the day. Hence knowing it is in reasonably close proximity to a block of land reasonably well endowed with deer I paid my money - thinking it would be well worthwhile given the proximity to my a route I travel very frequently too (albeit some distance from home).

    Having the opportunity to pass the land nearly daily I frequented the land for short durations (<1hr) on probably 30+ occasions through the season, and spent long times (~5hrs) stalking it on 6+ occasions...however I saw NO deer. I visited the site at dawn, dusk, midday throughout the season. Generally one or two trails of slot marks were present, and one week there were about a dozen...but no actual sightings were ever seen. Having subsequently talked to locals they inform me that there used to be a small herd that frequented the land, but that they hadn't been seen for quite a while. My suspicions are that the land has either been shot out and/or the deer are very transient and simply pass through at night.

    My question is - do you simply pay your money and take your chance...or given I was told that it was rare to not see deer on the land, that I have the right to a refund (partial or full)?

    I must admit feeling somewhat disheartened as a relative newcomer who has been left with a bad taste in his mouth about this situation, hence I would like to hear from anyone with knowledge of the etiquette in this sort of situation.

    Many thanks,
    Oly

  2. #2
    On the assumption that the guy who runs the syndicate has good knowledge of the ground, suggest you ask him to take you out. If this is a small piece of ground it is very possible that it does not hold deer but as transient deer pass through it. I have a mate who has a 50 acre plot located between two very good areas. Hit his ground right and it is cracking but you could spend many hours there on many occasions and see nothing.

    Taking on land or buying into a syndicate does require several considerations but at the end of the day after making the decision to part with your cash it is up to you and hopefully you have decided well.

  3. #3
    Some input into the land helps if its managed syndicate, to keep your animals intrested in the place. As with all wild animals, they roam, as the gent above says you go 1 day & your spoilt for choise, go another 3 times after & see nothing, like fishing & any sport, there is a certain amount of uncertanty. Bait your river well, use the right hook, study the lay out, & use ya skills.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by MrYou View Post
    Bait your river well..
    But surely, sir, a gentleman will only cast to a rising fish?



    Caveat emptor, I fear Oly. Have you spoken with the shoot captain since you paid your subs? Ask to see his cull record and, as Gazza suggests, invite him to accompany you on a visit to show you where he has taken beasts in the past.
    /l\ Y gwir yn erbyn y byd /l\

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Iwrch View Post
    But surely, sir, a gentleman will only cast to a rising fish?



    Caveat emptor, I fear Oly. Have you spoken with the shoot captain since you paid your subs? Ask to see his cull record and, as Gazza suggests, invite him to accompany you on a visit to show you where he has taken beasts in the past.
    Cast to a rising fish - that has been my ethos so far...

    I spoke to the organiser half way through the season - and he showed me round the ground prior to me taking the land on including the locations/times he had shot before - and he said to wait until the crop started growing. Although I haven't seen his cull records.

  6. #6
    Oly
    pm me his name and area of ground
    As I may be able to shed a little light if I know the person and land in question
    ATB

  7. #7
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    No disrespest but have you made the assumption that the grounds not productive on the basis that you havent seen or shot any deer.

    Have you surveyed the area with a lamp at night? on more than one occasion.
    Have you seen any evidence of crotties?
    Have you noticed any slots indicating deer passaging damp or wet areas?
    Is there any evidence of browsing lines to the perimeters of any woodland?
    Is the any evidence of young saplings being frayed.

    Etc Etc
    Deer may be transiant and moving from one area across yours on a regular basis and you havent been in a position to make those observations.

    Dont get me wrong you may well be correct, but dont jump to conclusions there are no deer on the ground or using some areas.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Mannlicher_Stu View Post
    No disrespest but have you made the assumption that the grounds not productive on the basis that you havent seen or shot any deer.

    Have you surveyed the area with a lamp at night? on more than one occasion.
    Have you seen any evidence of crotties?
    Have you noticed any slots indicating deer passaging damp or wet areas?
    Is there any evidence of browsing lines to the perimeters of any woodland?
    Is the any evidence of young saplings being frayed.

    Etc Etc
    Deer may be transiant and moving from one area across yours on a regular basis and you havent been in a position to make those observations.

    Dont get me wrong you may well be correct, but dont jump to conclusions there are no deer on the ground or using some areas.
    Stu
    I take it you hav an in-depth knowledge on fallow here to make these comments???

  9. #9
    In our syndicate there is one guy who always moans that there are no deer!! On two occasions I have told him where and when to go, each time he has got a roe. He's a shooter more than a stalker.
    I'm not implying the same situation applies to you, but what I will say is that when I first started stalking I never saw a beast, then I explored the land with my dogs and they soon indicated where the deer were, it was then down to me to discover WHEN they were there.
    Needless to say my stalking methods have changed considerably in the process - Give it time and I'm sure it will all come good.

    It takes time to get to know the land, and I don't think this is info that should be shared openly, after all what works for one might never produce for another.

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by stone View Post
    Stu
    I take it you hav an in-depth knowledge on fallow here to make these comments???

    Where I used to live at Yealand Redmayne Nr Carnforth we did have many fallow that where transiant so I could observe their traits They are definitely more active during darkness, many a time panning the lamp across the fields at night there were fallow eyes everywhere but during the day rarely did they emerge from the sucurity of the forest verges. and they regular used to go across my land to reach other woodland so I am a little familiar with fallow inc having shot quite a few.

    I once put up a high seat in a tree and observed them very close to they are oblivious to any danger from above and regular would walk directly under my hide some 8ft above the ground
    Last edited by Mannlicher_Stu; 02-04-2011 at 20:25.

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