What comes after Level 2?

AW thats what i did after a couple of years !

and i have to say its quite nice watching other people stalk and seeing how they do things , also greatly satisfying when a portfolio goes through with no hick ups !
 
Paul you should know beter when you are an AW you are not passing on any skills or experience. You are watching so that you can check a cadidate has reach a certain standard. Make sure he can fill the PC set out in the DMQ portfolio. Lee6.5 has it bang on and thats why he gets the big bucks for it.;). TJ If i were you i would go out and help others if you think you want to progress just watch out for the deerstalking parasites that will use every opertunity to get a freebe with out helping others them selves.. That said it is real satisfiying helping some one else in to the sport that apreciates it. Then move on to AW, You will then be well prepared. OR YOU COULD GO DOWN THE CONTRACTOR ROUTE THE FC WOULD BE THE PEOPLE TO CONTACT FOR THAT ONE. Its a great passion and there is always something to learn even if it dont get you a wee tin badge.:lol:
 
Hi Stu,
The next step up, or, no that is wrong there is no step up because Deer Stalking is not or should not be a 'Hierarchy' thing.
But I can certainly suggest, to broaden your knowledge even more once level 2 is achieved, is to attend the Deer Managers course, or Advanced Stalker course as it used to be known.
It is a much more commercial side of Deer Managent, not so much you on the ground but you in charge of guys on the ground and knowing first hand what they should be doing to get it right without falling foul of the various legislation required to run such a venture.
 
Having now completed it, what comes next......Is there a natural step to take?

TJ

TJ

Don't worry, somewhere down the line there will be a level 3 then 4 then 5 then 6....

Lot of businesses out there depend on it.

Or am I just being cynical???


(sorry, meant to add well done in completing it)
 
Cheers for the comments.

I don't have the commitment at the moment to become an AW with my work. Since getting serious about the stalking, I concentrated on the L1 then 3 years to get my L2 trying to get as much experience as I could.

Now having done it, it only seems right to try and progress. What's peoples views (who have done it) on the Deer Managers Course?

TJ
 
TJ

Willie-Gunn has done the deers managers course and said it was very interesting and worth doing. I know he is away at the mo but is back by end of week.
Drop him a PM I'm sure he will have a chat about it.

Hope all is ok with you mate.

Jon
 
Will be doing the Deer Managers Course next year been Busy doing Clay instructors stufff this year and you cant do everything. They run the Deer Managers course at the Hotel at Catterick Bridge I beleive.

Dave
 
Paul you should know beter when you are an AW you are not passing on any skills or experience. You are watching so that you can check a cadidate has reach a certain standard.

tut! :lol: You must get all good ones then :doh:I've had a couple where you give them a chance and they clearly haven't got a clue so you do a bit of work with them and start guiding them to try and get on a beast. In thinking about it I had a guy a couple of seasons who didn't get out of the parking spot without having to do refresher training on safe rifle handling after he swept the muzzle through me and then started loading the rifle while it was pointing at houses!

It's painful when your with a no hoper :rolleyes: Fortunately though, most are decent lads... phew!
 
Cheers for the comments.

I don't have the commitment at the moment to become an AW with my work. Since getting serious about the stalking, I concentrated on the L1 then 3 years to get my L2 trying to get as much experience as I could.

Now having done it, it only seems right to try and progress. What's peoples views (who have done it) on the Deer Managers Course?

TJ

Don't waste your time you'll learn more on a best practice weekend ,get out and hone your practical stalking skills bits of paper do not find and stalk deer it is experience that does that .

The AW bit is far from fun, the fact being it is a pain in the arse, unless your making loads of cash out of it which isn't giving anything back , it only makes the system further flawed I've seen it that many times, AWs telling people I can't write that up you'll need another visit ££££££ there's nothing that cannot be written up even if it is shot up the arse .

Mistakes do happen, more than we would like to admit, I've seen all sorts from people cutting right through the visera, to cutting the tendons in there thumb requiring 20 stitches that was aftehe fainted . lol.

Just get out and enjoy there's nothing to prove .
 
Paul what i was simply pointing out that when you are witnessing you are not helping . Memebers on here might think it is a simple process to jump from lev1 (theory) to Lev 2 (practical ) From your post it would suggest that this is possible as you would help them. I to have had quite a few that have not made the standard and have stopped the assesment and done some training with them . But to any one on the site who is thinking of doing Lev two or thinking of becomming an AW they (Training and Doing the Lev2 assesment ) are to seperate things.
My expeariences tell me there is a short fall between the theory and the practical qualifications.
 
Yeh I know what you mean and you're very right. L2 candidates doing it because 'it's about time' that have been culling for years compared to a guy that has shot a beast as a guest and saw it get gralloched. Says it all really.
 
Hi TJ.

I think all the posts here express valid points of view to be honest - but they do also sum up our stalking world...

I did the BDS Deer Manager course in Oct 2010 at Thetford. It was enjoyable / frustrating / nerve racking ( the shooting test ) / thought provoking / hard work / challenging - and very good fun. We had a wide range of experience levels on the course, from those who definitely needed more exposure to deer, to those who shoot 500+ a year ..... Yes it is `another` bit of paper, but it is more than that aswell, it shows commitment to the cause of the deer we manage, and it would be a brave person who said that they did not learn anything from doing the course !!!!

It is not cheap, but it is a good step, and will arm you with A LOT of knowledge. Since doing that course, I have picked up more stalking permission than in my previous 10 years. I can now provide a creditable Risk Assessment, a Deer Census, a proposed Cull Plan, and if I don`t get the stalking, then my name and number is on the document, and if they want to call me in the future when the things go pear shaped, then I can confidently negotiate better terms.

Passing the course personally gave me a lot of confidence. I personally choose not to be an AW, but I will always try to help people starting off in stalking if I was recommended to them.

Good luck whatever you decide.

ATB. Neil.
 
Hi TJ.

I think all the posts here express valid points of view to be honest - but they do also sum up our stalking world...

I did the BDS Deer Manager course in Oct 2010 at Thetford. It was enjoyable / frustrating / nerve racking ( the shooting test ) / thought provoking / hard work / challenging - and very good fun. We had a wide range of experience levels on the course, from those who definitely needed more exposure to deer, to those who shoot 500+ a year ..... Yes it is `another` bit of paper, but it is more than that aswell, it shows commitment to the cause of the deer we manage, and it would be a brave person who said that they did not learn anything from doing the course !!!!

It is not cheap, but it is a good step, and will arm you with A LOT of knowledge. Since doing that course, I have picked up more stalking permission than in my previous 10 years. I can now provide a creditable Risk Assessment, a Deer Census, a proposed Cull Plan, and if I don`t get the stalking, then my name and number is on the document, and if they want to call me in the future when the things go pear shaped, then I can confidently negotiate better terms.

Passing the course personally gave me a lot of confidence. I personally choose not to be an AW, but I will always try to help people starting off in stalking if I was recommended to them.

Good luck whatever you decide.

ATB. Neil.

+ 1 Neil

I did DM Course 3 years ago at Wadhurst, fairly expensive but good value for the quality of information and instruction. Definitely worth doing if you have a real interest in UK Deer beyond being a 'shooter'.

I agree about the AW thing, personally I would not do it, and ditto on the free help to a beginner. if asked.

Interesting variation of views on this topic.

ATB

Peter
 
Hi TJ.

I think all the posts here express valid points of view to be honest - but they do also sum up our stalking world...

I did the BDS Deer Manager course in Oct 2010 at Thetford. It was enjoyable / frustrating / nerve racking ( the shooting test ) / thought provoking / hard work / challenging - and very good fun. We had a wide range of experience levels on the course, from those who definitely needed more exposure to deer, to those who shoot 500+ a year ..... Yes it is `another` bit of paper, but it is more than that aswell, it shows commitment to the cause of the deer we manage, and it would be a brave person who said that they did not learn anything from doing the course !!!!

It is not cheap, but it is a good step, and will arm you with A LOT of knowledge. Since doing that course, I have picked up more stalking permission than in my previous 10 years. I can now provide a creditable Risk Assessment, a Deer Census, a proposed Cull Plan, and if I don`t get the stalking, then my name and number is on the document, and if they want to call me in the future when the things go pear shaped, then I can confidently negotiate better terms.

Passing the course personally gave me a lot of confidence. I personally choose not to be an AW, but I will always try to help people starting off in stalking if I was recommended to them.

Good luck whatever you decide.

ATB. Neil.

TJ

As Jon (243Varmint) mentioned above, I also did the Deer Manager's course. In fact I sat the self same course as Neil at Thetford last year, along with a couple of other members from this site. The course itself was written up in a recent issue of Sporting Rifle - I can copy the article and email it to you if you're interested - but Simon Barr's summary reinforced Neil's comments. I'd also heartily endorse what Neil said about the course, in that it's challenging, frightening, and enjoyable in about equal measure :).

If you can't make up your mind regarding the course, think about it this way: If what you're interested in is stalking deer then you can probably give the Deer Managers course a miss, but if what you're interested in is deer then you should do it. There's a subtle but important difference. The DSC1 and DSC2 focus on deer stalking from a theoretical and/or practical perspective whereas the Deer Managers course spends very little time on the practical stalking side of things - it is much more about deer management, both park and wild.

Alternatively, if you look at the cost of the course and your first reaction is to think "that would buy me three days stalking" then spend the money on stalking ;)

Dom
 
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