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Thread: Kosher venison

  1. #1
    SD Regular
    Join Date
    Jun 2011
    where men are men and sheep are worried

    Kosher venison

    Ive just been asked if i can supply the odd beast to be killed kosher , is there such a method for wild deer ?
    As i see it the deer would have to be stunned first then hung and slit , surely this cannot be possible with wild or even park deer ?

    Your thoughts or even if possible a source for kosher venison .

  2. #2
    Yes it seems it is possible. I know of clients being taken out to shoot Deer (on a deer park) and then run across to bleed the poor animal with a big knife before it is fully expired.

  3. #3
    Many years ago visiting friends,in Kenya when we shot for the pot. Antelope down, Muslim porters rushed over, slit throat and provided blood came out ok, They some times had to jump on the chest. I would think kosher would work the same way.

  4. #4
    I saw a piece on one of the countryside program about halal stalking, can't remember which one it was now. I seem to remember that the cut had to be made straight across the throat, just below the jaw, and that a single stroke had to sever everything to the bone, and that this was considered ok for halal. Not sure on the "kosher" rules, but I believe they are similar?

    Have to talk to a Rabi with experience in these things, though I bet you'll get as many answers as you would asking a firearms department a simple question on firearms law.

  5. #5
    I have a mate who is a practicing Jew, I'll ask him. As an aside, did you know Jewish people cannot eat Rabbit? It was due to a mix up made by Moses. He saw rabbits apparently chewing the cud. They do not have a cloven hoof, and so were deemed unfit for Jews to eat. The rabbits were in fact teeth grinding as all rodents do, and so should in fact be suitable for a Jewish table. However as the jewish religion is based upon the book of laws written way back then, Jews still cannot eat the meat. My mate does love a good Kosher bacon butty when no one is looking though

  6. #6
    And according to the Roman Catholics, duck is a fish and can therefore be eaten on Fridays. Told you religious law made about as much sense as British firearms law!

  7. #7
    Many years ago I was "on a job" in a busy abbatoir in the centre of a big City. Out of curiosity, I went to see a beast being slaughtered.

    I was told that all beasts being done that morning were destined for the "Kosher" market and the chap killing them (a Rabbi?) had flown up from down south that morning.

    At that time I was completely ignorant of these matters and after asking, I was informed that due to religious beliefs, animals with 2 toes could only be eaten after being bleed to death.

    I watched one cow being done and it seemed it was a bothched job. The poor beast got one front leg out of the pen/device which it was contained in and turned upside down in order that its throat be cut.

    It was bellowing like crazy and its leg was thrashing around and it looked like it might get out.

    The chap carrying out the deed was being cursed at and shouted at by the drovers who worked there and was obviously under pressure to get the deed done.

    Anyway, it was done and I ended up the colour of the floor tiles and to be honest I was totally horrified that this practise was carried out in the name of religion!

    Ironically, I was there in the first place investigating a spate of incidents and crimes committed by Animal Libeeration Front or whatever they were called at that time. I think if they had witnessed what I had, they would hacve probably raised the building to the ground!

    If your up for doing them with a knife for religious beliefs, you are a better man than me. I think its one thing to despatch an animal using a knife when its to quickly end its suffering or on safety grounds but I wouldn't wish to do it myself.
    Last edited by bobthedug; 14-04-2012 at 15:41.

  8. #8
    Judaism does not countenance hunting. For its meat to be kosher the animal has to be slaughtered, i.e. bled to death, by a rabbi trained in the practice of shechita.

    If you want to supply kosher venison, it will have to pass through an abbatoir and be slaughtered in the approved manner.
    Last edited by Iwrch; 14-04-2012 at 15:48.
    /l\ Y gwir yn erbyn y byd /l\

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by Iwrch View Post
    Judaism does not countenance hunting. For its meat to be kosher the animal has to be slaughtered, i.e. bled to death, by a rabbi trained in the practice of shechita.

    If you want to supply kosher venison, it will have to pass through an abbatoir and be slaughtered in the approved manner.
    Correct answer!

  10. #10
    I Can shed some light on this. I am Muslim by faith and also stalk deer. Now in Islam we must only eat "halal" meat. Halal is the Arabic work for Lawful. In order for a domesticated animal to be Lawful to eat it must be slaughtered in a prescribed way, the rulings are as follows:

    1. The animal must be healthy at the point of slaughter, e.g. it must be seen to look fit enough that it would live another year.
    2. The animal must be slaughtered by a practicing Muslim
    3. the animal must face towards the direction of Mecca.
    4. If more than one animal is to be slaughtered, they should be kept separate from each other and one animal should not witness the others death
    5. All blood must be washed away before the next animal is to be slaughtered, it shouldnít see any signs of previously slaughtered animals
    6. A drink of water should be given to the animal before slaughter
    7. The Knife must be RAZOR sharp so that it can shave the hair of the back of your hand
    8. The Knife Must not be sharpened in front of animals waiting to be slaughtered.
    9. The slaughter man must pronounce the name of God in the form of a Arabic prayer and sever the carotid arteries, wind pipe, and jugular veins in one swift back and forth motion insuring not to pause in-between.
    10. The animalís nervous reflex must completely finish before any dressing shall commence.

    To most this sounds inhumane and cruel. I have personally slaughtered lambs in the halal method following each step fully and can say within 10 seconds of the fatal cut there was no eye reflex. When this is done properly there is a massive pressure drop in the animalís body and brain resulting in unconsciousness, then there is huge and total Hemorrhaging to the animal resulting in a fast death.

    Now as Wild Deer are wild and not in our control the above would be impossible to carry out when stalking, therefore there is a different ruling when "hunting wild game"
    Before shooting, the same prayer must be recited. If the animal is dead on approach it is still classed as "Lawful" Or Halal. If it is still alive it must be bled in the same way as for a domesticated animal.

    Now in order for meat to be classed as kosher there are various stipulations attached which I am not 100% about so I wonít try to comment, however I know that the animal MUST be fully conscious at the point of slaughter regardless whether it is wild or domesticated.

    Chanel 4 contacted me a couple of years ago, they wanted to do a program with Gordon Ramsey on the F word about Halal venison, click the link to watch. forward to 15:43.
    In the program I showed Ramsay how I would go about producing halal venison. Obviously the one he shot on the program is not halal and I am merely showing him and the viewers what I would do.
    I hope this was helpful and if anyone wants further info just ask.
    Last edited by mo; 14-04-2012 at 16:23.

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