Police Search rights

shootingduckdog

Well-Known Member
Following on from the ammo under bolt question I am curious what rights the police have to search your vehicle? I have been stopped quite a few times lamping and although reg and name checks are carried out I have never been asked to produce my weapons nor to allow the officers access to my vehicle. Now to be clear I have not been doing anything wrong and the police I have encountered have never been called out to me or because of me. A couple came over as quite zealous but still no search, as such I assumed that they had no rights if they had no cause? Anyone know?

On one notable occasion I had been stalking first and had 3 roe in the back of the truck. It struck me that had they searched I would have had the devils own job demonstrating where and when the deer had been taken. Driving around at night and with dead deer in the back!!!!!
 
When you get checked (ie) name registration etc it will come up automaticaly that you are a registered certificate holder, so if nothing is untoward then there is no need to check you out. (get stopped all the time at unsociable hrs)


Mauser.
 
Look up PACE on the net for most general powers. Each act Firearms act, Misuse of drugs, etc give different powers.
 
47 Powers of constables to stop and search.

(1)A constable may require any person whom he has reasonable cause to suspect-
(a)of having a firearm, with or without ammunition, with him in a public place; or
(b)to be committing or about to commit, elsewhere than in a public place, an offence relevant for the purposes of this section,
to hand over the firearm or any ammunition for examination by the constable.
(2)It is an offence for a person having a firearm or ammunition with him to fail to hand it over when required to do so by a constable under subsection (1) of this section.
(3)If a constable has reasonable cause to suspect a person of having a firearm with him in a public place, or to be committing or about to commit, elsewhere than in a public place, an offence relevant for the purposes of this section, the constable may search that person and may detain him for the purpose of doing so.
(4)If a constable has reasonable cause to suspect that there is a firearm in a vehicle in a public place, or that a vehicle is being or is about to be used in connection with the commission of an offence relevant for the purposes of this section elsewhere than in a public place, he may search the vehicle and for that purpose require the person driving or in control of it to stop it.
(5)For the purpose of exercising the powers conferred by this section a constable may enter any place.
(6)The offences relevant for the purpose of this section are those under sections 18(1) and (2) and 20 of this Act.


Above is a straight cut and paste from www.legislation.gov.uk

Hope that helps with your query.


Regards

BP
 
in my own experience i prefer to cooperate with the police etc rather than quote rights and laws, at the end of the day we all tend to hunt the same areas regularly and i am sure we can all do without making life harder on ourselves. Normally the first two or three words out of your mouth define the rest of the conversation when dealing with the police. I learned a lesson early on as a 17yr boy, i drove the wrong way up a one way street to avoid road blocks, only to find an RUC officer shining a torch and aiming a rifle at me, i was considering reversing back but someone else had the same idea and was tight behind me but to cut a long story short. i was telling the story to my boss the next day and he said "keith son i will give you some advice" if it is a constable say hello sergeant , if it is a sergeant call him inspector and if it is an inspector call him sir, now how did you address the officer. Well i said i got the first four letters of ****stable out and it went down hill very quickly from there.

keith
 
Challenged the other day in the edge of a permission by two dog handlers, five more within earshot, on a training exercise.
Rifle slung on shoulder.
I asked if they needed paperwork, they replied "No Need"
Must have been cross checked from car reg number.
 
I believe in full cooperation I was simply curious why I had not been searched or asked to produce the weapons. I guess its cos I'm a good guy!!!!!!!!!!
 
I believe in full cooperation I was simply curious why I had not been searched or asked to produce the weapons. I guess its cos I'm a good guy!!!!!!!!!!
shootingduckdog (that's some name!), did you produce your gun/s, and if so I suppose the POlice having checked your details on the NFA register, cross referencing on the PNC (POLICE NATIONAL COMPUTER), and DVLA, may have wished to verify that any weapons you had were logged on the varios systems, perhaps ??
 
Is there any reason why you wouldnt co-operate with the police? Yes at times they can pop up at an inconvenience but overall I would prefer that than if they didn't. If you get stopped and they do or don't want to see documents then why not show them. If legislation says to store bolts, ammo or anything else for that matter in a certain way then why wouldnt you...
 
I was stopped a few weeks back (faulty brake light) and when the officer did his checks, it was mentioned that I have a firearms licence.
I told the officer that there were no firearms in the car, and he just told me that he wasn't bothered anyway.
No mention of a search or anything, he just couldn't care less, he stopped me for a traffic offense, and thatwas it.
 
I believe in full cooperation I was simply curious why I had not been searched or asked to produce the weapons. I guess its cos I'm a good guy!!!!!!!!!!

I'm sure that if you are polite and co-operative it counts a lot in your favour. Being well presented and in a decent car helps. If you drove an old rust bucket and had a boot full of sight hounds then I expect you'd get more attention paid!
 
Ben, which piece of legislation is that quote from? Is it the firearms act?

Apache, my mates who are coppers tell me of a thing called the "attitude" test. Behave like a normal, reasonable person and they will be reasonable in return. Behave like a moron and they'll throw the book at you.
 
Matt your mates aren't wrong. By the time your pulled over most checks come back (unless its busy) if you've got no reports on PNC,don't stink of drink and don't look sus unlikely that a search would take place.
 
47 Powers of constables to stop and search.

(1)A constable may require any person whom he has reasonable cause to suspect-
(a)of having a firearm, with or without ammunition, with him in a public place; or
(b)to be committing or about to commit, elsewhere than in a public place, an offence relevant for the purposes of this section,
to hand over the firearm or any ammunition for examination by the constable.
(2)It is an offence for a person having a firearm or ammunition with him to fail to hand it over when required to do so by a constable under subsection (1) of this section.
(3)If a constable has reasonable cause to suspect a person of having a firearm with him in a public place, or to be committing or about to commit, elsewhere than in a public place, an offence relevant for the purposes of this section, the constable may search that person and may detain him for the purpose of doing so.
(4)If a constable has reasonable cause to suspect that there is a firearm in a vehicle in a public place, or that a vehicle is being or is about to be used in connection with the commission of an offence relevant for the purposes of this section elsewhere than in a public place, he may search the vehicle and for that purpose require the person driving or in control of it to stop it.
(5)For the purpose of exercising the powers conferred by this section a constable may enter any place.
(6)The offences relevant for the purpose of this section are those under sections 18(1) and (2) and 20 of this Act.


Above is a straight cut and paste from www.legislation.gov.uk

Hope that helps with your query.


Regards

BP


This maybe the law BUT the use of the word IF is two iffy ,let them ask the questions and produce a warrant ,how would you know if they seize your weapons just where they will end up ,without the correct warrant to seize your property .

Look at the ned culture of this country ,neds know there rights outside in ever wonder why the police don't bother them ,because they know there rights and instantly they can and will use a lawyer ,who couldn't care less he's only looking at his bank balance ,and will argue black is white for wee johnny from the broken home .

Let them ask the questions but unless they can produce a warrant to seize your property do not let them touch or see the property .
 
Ben, which piece of legislation is that quote from? Is it the firearms act?


Matt H, the Police have a number of powers under various legislaton with regard to searches of an individual, vehicles and premises namely: STOP AND SEARCH, MISUSE OF DRUGS ACT 1971 (sec 23) PACE 1984 (POLICE AND CRIMINAL EVIDENCE) sec 1, 32, 16, 17, 18 & 19 to list but a few, and the FA Act 1968, some of the searches mentioned must be with a search warrant or a Magistrates warrant. Some searches carried out under various sections of PACE, and the FA Act may uncover other offences, or searching for a person who is believed to be at an address, and which may lead to the arrest of that person, or an other example ie: person stopped with a light off, spoken to unable to provide their personal details, including DOB, home address, gets arrested under sec 25 PACE, taken to Police Station, further enquiries carried out, discovered car stolen, address provided by this person, Police attend, it's not his address, but the person who lives at the adrresss supplied the arrested person gives the correct address, Police attend, search it find all sorts of stolen good, drugs guns etc...etc..
 
unless they can produce a warrant to seize your property do not let them touch or see the property .

Brave man... and dumb... but easy advice to give to someone else all the same.

By all means question the Police as to their purpose and satisfy yourself of how "serious" their intent is... but if they mention magic expressions such as "The Police Act" or the "Terrorism Act" or that they "have grounds for believing an offence is being, or might be, committed" you will not be co-operating if you don't roll over. Not co-operating is not a good plan. That doesn't mean you can't ask questions though.

So, I am not advocating letting some zealous and ill behaved officer of the law, with an obvious "attitude", just lift your gear, but once you've been told the reason and powers they are acting under you will have to make an informed decision as to just how far you'll let them go before you raise any objection. Frankly, objection is nearly always best raised after the fact. Sadly, you are also being invited to enter an utter minefield of "button pushing" territory where every action of their's can be seen (even by folk less cynical than I) as a calculated opportunity for you to react in a manner which will later be claimed as evidence of your "intemperate" character... Keep your cool and preferably have enough savvy to have unimpeachable witnesses on hand... BTW that last piece of advice is invaluable in ALL dealings with authority. I have used it many times to sidestep absolute mountains of crap (I deal day in and day out with people who have some powers even the Police would consider Draconian). Also, take careful note of EVERYTHING that happens as though your liberty depended on it, because it just might. Say little but be civil, then there's less of a hole for you to have to dig your way out of later if it all does turn nasty.

The Police are not your friends, they should never be considered in the first instance as being "reasonable people" and they WILL "have you" in a heartbeat if you give them the least moment's cause, it's their job.

However, you can turn the tables you can let them dig the holes for themselves but it is royal p-i-t-a to deal with, for which the only compensation is your improved wisdom and their need for increased future care in their dealings with you. Incidentally, I've been there and survived intact more than a few times now, with more than a few "exuberant" agents of authority, by holding to my own advice.
 
Last edited:
Patrick, I understand all that, I was asking specifically where the list that was posted had come from. It's clearly lifted from a publication, with things like that I always like to be able to go away and read it in the context of the document it comes from. It is section 47, but of which document?
 
Patrick, I understand all that, I was asking specifically where the list that was posted had come from. It's clearly lifted from a publication, with things like that I always like to be able to go away and read it in the context of the document it comes from. It is section 47, but of which document?

matth, such a difficult child!!!!!

I think the person means sec 47 of the FA 1968 which reads: sec 47 (1) a constable may require any person whom he reasonable cause to suspect-

a) of having a firearm, with, or without ammunition, with him, in a public place; or
b) to be committing, or about to commit, elsewhere than in a public place, an offence relevant for the purposes of this section. to hand over the firearm, or ammunitiion for examination by the constable etc. If you wish matth send me a pm and I shall scan the section and send it to you, i think someone else may have written the full text of this section in a linked thread, or even this thread, i hope this assists patrict
 
Thanks Patric. I can get the relevant legislation online, just wanted to know which piece of legislation it referred to. If people referenced their quotes properly it would be much easier! ;)
 
Back
Top