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Thread: Basic Standard

  1. #1

    Basic Standard

    There has been a lot of talk and hot air regards deer dogs lately. The subject has now took a dramatic turn suggesting that if a trained deer dog is needed for say a night licence approval or a FC contract. That standard should be wrote down and checked .
    So what would this basic standard look like and who would check all the dog? Baron Wolverine Jamross and the rest please feel free to reply

  2. #2
    The basic standard should surely be a dog that can find deer! It may not be able to meet all the criteria laid down by some, but does that matter, if it works for it's handler to his satisfaction should it then need to fulfil other peoples needs? Why try and introduce a level that will require administration and training all of which will need paying for! There are lots of dogs out there that find deer, many of which would be considered unsuitable by the purists.

    Just as there are many people that drive and a few that are advanced drivers, there is no need to become advanced drivers but it is normally done for personal satisfaction, why should it not be the same for dogs. If you wish to become an "advanced driver" of your dog then by all means go for it, but if you are happy and content then don't bother.

    John
    A clever man knows his strengths, a wise man knows his weaknesses

  3. #3
    6pointer . . .I think the ball rests wholly with the organisations who are stating that you need a 'trained dog'.
    As things stand neither SNH or the FC define what a trained dog is . . . I would assume in the simplest of terms, one that can find a deer.

    My dog hasn't competed in any trials, won any tests or passed any exams, but can sure as hell find a downed beast in a sea of sitka spruce.

    This old chestnut has come up a few times before, and I still fail to see why we as stalkers are desperately trying to burden ourselves with more needless red tape and bureaucracy.
    Last edited by Cadex; 04-10-2012 at 15:43.

  4. #4
    I must say I get a bit bored of all the standards.
    if it is not the DSC1/open/fullbore certificate argument its levels of training in dogs.

    surely if you have a dog you know if it is trained to find deer or not? you are going to look pretty stupid claiming it is when it cant find it's dinner bowl!

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by 6pointer View Post
    There has been a lot of talk and hot air regards deer dogs lately. The subject has now took a dramatic turn suggesting that if a trained deer dog is needed for say a night licence approval or a FC contract. That standard should be wrote down and checked .
    So what would this basic standard look like and who would check all the dog? Baron Wolverine Jamross and the rest please feel free to reply
    It seems to me that stalkers, especially in Scotland, are going to get a kind of standard imposed on them in the next few years. A bit like the FC saying you must have passed a DSC before you can stalk their ground.

    I would therefor pre-emt the authorities and propose to them simply the basic danish test. A 4-500 yard trail laid with tracking shoes and a little blood, a few 90/180% turns and 3-4 hours old. That should get 90%+ of the deer shot recovered.

    If enthousiasts want more difficult tests that would be for later.

    As to who should administer it? That is for the locals to decide. The BDS?

  6. #6
    Quote Originally Posted by barongcw View Post
    It seems to me that stalkers, especially in Scotland, are going to get a kind of standard imposed on them in the next few years. A bit like the FC saying you must have passed a DSC before you can stalk their ground.

    would therefor pre-emt the authorities and propose to them simply the basic danish test. A 4-500 yard trail laid with tracking shoes and a little blood, a few 90/180% turns and 3-4 hours old. That should get 90%+ of the deer shot recovered.

    If enthousiasts want more difficult tests that would be for later.

    As to who should administer it? That is for the locals to decide. The BDS?
    Interesting what makes you say that? I dont think your basic standard would be far of the mark but 4 hours? That I dont understand the reasoning, surely if this is imposed as you stated then surely the dog will be on the track within 1/2 hour tops.


    Nutty
    Last edited by nuttyspaniel; 04-10-2012 at 16:43.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by nuttyspaniel View Post
    Interesting what makes you say that? I dont think your basic standard would be far of the mark but 4 hours? That I dont understand the reasoning, surely if this is imposed as you stated then surely the dog will be on the track within 1/2 hour tops.


    Nutty
    No no no.....1/2 hour,gut shot,leg shot,goosed neck shot or head shot,goosed chest shot(brisket)or back shot,now what do people with their trained dogs do on each of the above??
    May I add Best Practice is wrong on a few of these....talk later I'm trying to kill stags.

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  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Wolverine View Post
    No no no.....1/2 hour,gut shot,leg shot,goosed neck shot or head shot,goosed chest shot(brisket)or back shot,now what do people with their trained dogs do on each of the above??
    May I add Best Practice is wrong on a few of these....talk later I'm trying to kill stags.
    Looking forward to your input Wolverine. Deer dog tracking is something I need to learn. Years ago when I was guiding
    if we had a bad shot beast which I couldnt find I would have to go and get the estate keeper who would then run his dogs over the over the area they werent fully trained teacking dogs but got the job done like my old spaniel.
    Nutty
    Last edited by nuttyspaniel; 04-10-2012 at 17:10.

  9. #9
    Quote Originally Posted by nuttyspaniel View Post
    Interesting what makes you say that?
    Nutty
    The autorities north of the border seem to me to be much more pro-active regarding stalking than those down south.

    It is but a matter of time before they realise the inconsistency of their position. Talking about "trained dogs" without defining what they mean.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by nuttyspaniel View Post
    I dont think your basic standard would be far of the mark but 4 hours? That I dont understand the reasoning, surely if this is imposed as you stated then surely the dog will be on the track within 1/2 hour tops.


    Nutty
    I would agree if you have your own dog but if you need help from a neighbour 3 hours pass quickly.

    Also the reason the Danes, whose standards I simply copied, choose three hours is that after that time period, depending on the vegetation of course, the hot scent tends to disappear thus forcing the dog to track cold scent which is more difficult.

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