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Thread: Is .17HMR Fox approved for Dorset

  1. #1

    Is .17HMR Fox approved for Dorset

    Hi
    Ive been getting several permissions for Vermin ie rabbit and rat etc these are small paddock stuff 4-10 acre so my sub 12ft lb airgun is fine

    however I've now got some saying if you can can you get the fox. which is obviously No at the moment

    so a FAC sect 1 would be the best idea to increase the range mainly for rabbit etc but still be able to take a fox if one came up

    looking a 22 lr would make sense as it can be silenced with subs but is bouncy would be close range for fox with HV but doubtfull to get it for Fox

    .17HMR looks fine for sub 100yrds which is plenty is less likely to bounce but noisy even with a mod
    .22WMR same again bit more poke (shame theres no subs or guns that will take 22lr subs accurately and full WMR load when needed)

    if it was large permissions and lots of foxes I would go .223 or even a deer/fox cal round

    Im not going to argue the Fox is vermin bit the HO guidelines clearly put Fox as a separate category from vermin or deer


    Rimfire arnt ticked for fox but 22 WMR and 17HMR arnt on the list tho more powerful than the 22lr that is

    but to clearly says rimfire can be approved under the right circumstances

    looking on the internet some forces Do give 17HMR for fox and some wont at all

    Does Dorset (their phone line is down at the moment)

    ATB

    Duncan
    Last edited by FGYT; 15-10-2012 at 09:51.

  2. #2
    what you have to consider are that rimfires are not true fox calibers, but in some situations are the perfect tool for the job. We end up shooting a fair number with the HMR due to the proximity of houses and roads and chest shots at 70 yards sees them drop no problem. Some forces will condition some won't however the fact is they work, I've had fox listed I've currently not got it listed but have a simple pest control and deer against all my guns and use accordingly. BASC did a piece a while back suggesting if you had a vermin condition then go for it as it has never been challenged and also its hard to argue foxes aren't vermin. The only problem with asking is you could have it spelt out that you can't shoot them which isn't ideal but does open the way for saying in that case you will need a CF

  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by al4x1 View Post
    what you have to consider are that rimfires are not true fox calibers, but in some situations are the perfect tool for the job. We end up shooting a fair number with the HMR due to the proximity of houses and roads and chest shots at 70 yards sees them drop no problem. Some forces will condition some won't however the fact is they work, I've had fox listed I've currently not got it listed but have a simple pest control and deer against all my guns and use accordingly. BASC did a piece a while back suggesting if you had a vermin condition then go for it as it has never been challenged and also its hard to argue foxes aren't vermin. The only problem with asking is you could have it spelt out that you can't shoot them which isn't ideal but does open the way for saying in that case you will need a CF
    maybe but the guidelines clearly show 4 categories and whether they should be called small vermin ie rabbit and large vermin fox is another matter
    law vcan define things differently than normal language (ie a 12ft lb air pistol is section 5 because it falls outside the definition of airweapon used in the Firearms act for section 1 not because its not an air weapon in real life)

    it would seem to be
    Vermin & Ground Game and other Small Quarry - rat, hare, rabbit, grey squirrel and other similar sized quarry.
    Medium Quarry – fox, feral cat and other similar sized quarry.
    Larger Quarry – feral goat, deer, boar, and other similar sized quarry.
    Dangerous Game – lion, elephant, buffalo, bear etc.


    Home office guidelines page 77

    http://www.homeoffice.gov.uk/publica...df?view=Binary

    heres BASC explaining them and this says CF only for Fox, feral cat, hare size verbatim as the HO guidelines (well except HO says Hare are small quarry)

    Its a download
    http://www.basc.org.uk/download.cfm/...76B6BAC5B0B933



    I want a long gun 99.9% for Rabbit but will if opportunity pops up take a fox

    a .223" isnt really a suitable rabbit gun for day to day use IMO and would be to big on most of my permissions

    I dont want 2 guns if i did it would be Rabbit /fox rimfire and a larger 7mm or bigger Deer gun (which some plod won't put for fox as its to big or will put fox only when stalking deer )

    ATB

    Duncan
    Last edited by FGYT; 15-10-2012 at 10:26.

  4. #4
    the simple facts are that you've answered your own question, if you stick to those guidelines and don't shoot to circumstances then you either won't be able to shoot foxes and rabbits with the same gun or will end up with a hornet for both. What I can say is rimfires work fine on foxes whatever the police advice sheets say in the right situation. Funny that BASC sheet as its not what was printed in the magazine a while back

    But its about main use and reason to acquire you wouldn't apply for a .22lr sole reason foxes it would be small vermin and then you could discuss fox in certain situations. For example back garden control in towns which a fair number of pesties have. Or close foxes while rabbiting, Herts are pretty good and include foxes as pests / vermin and will if wanted write it on your ticket some others won't so really its whatever you are happy with. I've never heard of anyones conditions being checked for fox so it is pretty much self regulated as we are a law abiding bunch its just some are happy to shoot foxes as vermin and some aren't

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by al4x1 View Post
    the simple facts are that you've answered your own question, if you stick to those guidelines and don't shoot to circumstances then you either won't be able to shoot foxes and rabbits with the same gun or will end up with a hornet for both. What I can say is rimfires work fine on foxes whatever the police advice sheets say in the right situation. Funny that BASC sheet as its not what was printed in the magazine a while back

    But its about main use and reason to acquire you wouldn't apply for a .22lr sole reason foxes it would be small vermin and then you could discuss fox in certain situations. For example back garden control in towns which a fair number of pesties have. Or close foxes while rabbiting, Herts are pretty good and include foxes as pests / vermin and will if wanted write it on your ticket some others won't so really its whatever you are happy with. I've never heard of anyones conditions being checked for fox so it is pretty much self regulated as we are a law abiding bunch its just some are happy to shoot foxes as vermin and some aren't
    the BASC thing does say written in 1999 so they may have changed i searched their site for .17HMR Fox

    but yes my main reason will be rabbit and small quarry im happy the cal is capable of fox

    just interested to know if Dorset is one of the areas that will put Fox on the ticket as a Secondary use. if they don't i wouldn't shoot one with the gun.

    ATB

    Duncan

  6. #6
    Ok Phones fixed at Dorset police

    they will grant Fox for secondary use in a .17HMR and Vermin and Fox will be on the ticket So thats good


    However thanks to the Olympics its 4-6 months to process an application

    ATB

    Duncan

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