property con

Scuttlebuttin

Well-Known Member
I've been having an issue with my house for some time, we bought it as a three bed house, but it turns out its only classed as two bedroom because the previous owner had converted the attic into the third bedroom without plans or building regs, because of the time from purchase to now, we have no recourse on the previous owner, we've approached the estate agent who listed the property and shown them the brochure listing the house as 3 bed, they don't want to know and suggested we approach the surveyor who did the survey, we have and have never had any paperwork relating to the survey, so we've approach the mortgage advisor, he pointed us in the direction of the solicitor who acted on our behalf, they have no paperwork and suggested contacting Alliance & Leicester (now Santander) to ask for any correspondence relating to us, they wrote back saying they have nothing and never have.
I'm smelling an elephant sized rat and am now wondering what else I can do?

Any suggestions?
 
Contact all of the governing body's,ie Law society,ombudsman etc etc......smoke em out,they will soon start running around!!
 
It may be worth contacting all the bodies you mentioned and asking for a copy of all information they have on yourself (or yourself and your wife if joint mortgage) under the Data Protection Act which legally entitles you to be able to see the information any organisation holds about you. There may be a small admin fee for this but it could turn up info that otherwise is supposedly missing. I've heard of people using this to get 5 years bank statements from a bank for a fee of £15 when the bank was going to charge £2 a page for the same statements through the normal means.

I wonder has anyone ever tried doing this with their local constabulary's licensing dept.?
 
regardless of no paperwork from your lawyer

If they cannot prove that they advised you that the property you were about to purchase had work done without planning or building consent then they have to be liable.
otherwise why are they involved!?

you do have recourse on the previous owner.
you have particulars of the house when sold.
If they did the work and failed to mention that the conversion did not have a building warrant or the estate agent failed to mention that an aspect of the house was built without consent (you would require planning unless a dorma window or similar outwardly visible change is made as far as I am aware, building work within the foot print within the same use is not controlled by planning but is controlled by building standards, however they are able to retrospectively authorise changes assuming no contravention has occurred)

surveyors dont do anything that Lloyd Grossman couldn't do. they won't be liable for anything

But:
negligent lawyer
false advertising by the estate agent/vendor
lack of due diligence by the mortgage company


take your pick
 
Normally, the surveyor should have advised the lender that the loft conversion would require Building Regs, and included a recommendation to seek confirmation that all necessary consents were in place. Without the surveyor's report, it may prove to be an uphill struggle; Santander should have a copy somewhere (unless the mortgage has been paid off) and the advice regarding the Data Protection Act is worth following.
 
We bought the house in 1997, my current mortgage advisor called me at 1am and told me he has been speaking to a legal mate of his who is having a dig around for me, he said I should complain to the Estate Agent Ombudsman abut the estate agent involved, I've just sent them an e-mail and await a reply.


Fingers Crossed.

Thanks for the replies too.
 
If you do track down the survey, contact the surveyor and ask for a copy of their complaints handling procedure.
 
are you looking to sell?
Did you pay more because you thought it was a 3 bedroom?

I live in a house where 2 of the bedrooms are box rooms without windows.
perfect for me and I paid probably over the odds as it served my purpose.

unless you think you have paid too much (but as it was 15 yrs ago that is a struggle) or cant sell as a 3 bed now you know....what do you want to achieve?

I would pursue your lawyer and the estate agent personally....but then I do love a good arguement

A building consent application form could clear it all up.
Have you asked about that?
 
No doubt such things should have been picked up at the time but after so long I fear it is too late to try to correct things. You should be able to get a quick legal opinion from the local CAB or perhaps from your trade union solicitors if you are a member of a trade union.
I wouldn't waste money on trying to take it further after so long.
 
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Kernel,
What is the actual problem here?
Are you being asked to retrospectively apply for planning consent?
Are you being requested to return the '3rd' bedroom back to an attic?
Are you being told you cannot market the property as 3 bedrooms because of safety issues?

Ultimately the house is what it is now - it has 3 bedrooms irrespective of what it is classed as. Unless any of the above are relevant, surely you can state what it is on any sale particulars (after all, sale particulars on houses are not exactly always accurate!), you can dictate what the asking price is compared to other 3-bedroom properties in the area? And unless there is a regulatory reaon why you cannot sell the property, anyone viewing the property and wanting to buy it will (hopefully) pay market price. Are you looking for a solution to a problem that actually isn't there?

(Edit: apologies - I'm assuming you're trying to sell?)
 
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We cannot have retrosective planning consent as the work that has been done by the previous owner was done without building regs so doesn't meet current standards, we carried out work using a schedule of works drawn up by the Home Improvment Agency/Local Council to make the property legally conform and then it could be used as a bedroom, after completion, the council came for the final inspection and to sign off, they informed us that the work we'd done was wong, even though it was done to the specification we'd been given by them.

We've been given the option to either turn it back into an attic space, or spend several thousand £s more doing more work on top of the 7K we've spent to date.

We've also been informed that even if we wish to sell it, we still have to do either of the above to legally list it as a two bed with attic or a two bed with legal 3rd bedroom/attic conversion.

We bought the house as 3 bed, but cannot use it as such because of the ongoing problems, the same goes for trying to sell it which we don't want to do.

The officer from the council has informed me that I have to apply for a Regularisation Certificate, so on top of the paying for work we still have to do, it's going to cost £525 in fees for a "loft that does not include dormer construction", we've spent/wasted almost £7,000 so far and will have to spend the same again in order to get the certificate.

As far as I'm concerned, the council are at fault for giving me a schedule of works that I had to adhere to that were wrong in the first place, then they come along and ask me to do more work at my expense.
 
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Not an unusual situation. So many people have carried out unauthorised loft conversions that don't comply with buildig regulations that often only come to light when trying to sell or extending the mortgage.
 
As far as I'm concerned, the council are at fault for giving me a schedule of works that I had to adhere to that were wrong in the first place, then they come along and ask me to do more work at my expense.

so pursue the council.

But to be honest unless you are trying to sell it as a 3rd bedroom it is up to you what you use it for.
 
I built a double garage for an engineer. We had planning and building consent. However building control came back to him and asked for load test certificates. He said no. He had calculated to allow for everything. If the council though it was wrong they should approach him with the figures not the other way round. Ask the council, in writing for the problem not the solution. They gave you the spec so they should give you the reason the spec does not add up. It is typical that building control likes to push it on self build. Jim
 
If the relevant council had dealings with the original occupier/builder, written records will be available, the fact that a certificate of completion either exists/ or does not, will put the ball back in the councils development office's court.
 
One point, how long after the council gave you instructions did you do the work. Regs change constantly. They may have been correct whEn they
went to print jim
 
It definitely appears from the way you lay out the fact that your best bet is to pursue your solicitor in the first instance. They should have provided you with a report following the searches on your property. Within these searches they will have asked the previous owners of your house about any works they have undertaken on the property. The previous owners then will have informed the solicitors of the extension and your solicitor should at this point have investigated the compliance of the extension with the current regulations. If this was not done by your solicitor then they are the ones who you should go after.
 
The previous did the illegal attic conversion in 1993, so in retrospect he should have worked with 1991 regulations, but the work was carried out without them and according to the council, building regs were never applied or asked for. The paperwork we were given was issued to us in June 2010, but we didn't start work until Late September, but the officer from the council who came to inspect the work we did, told us that the work we'd done, would not have complied to the 1985 regulations.
We have completion certificates for the kitchen/bedroom and garage build, but nothing else.
 
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