Experience needed

Tomm

Well-Known Member
Hello. Am in the process of having my fac closed condition removed, I have only held my certificate for 6 months so fair enough they are asking me to prove I am safe etc. what I'm looking for is for someone for me to go out with or to come out with me I don't have to shoot live quarry asi have evidence of this from paid stalks just show I have a safe understanding of backstops safe gun handling etc which I do. I know this will be a pain in the ass for someone but I will pay my way and make it worth your time, weather it's labouring or helping out etc, I am 18 but have my own rifles and car so transport is not a problem. Pease let me know if you can help. I don't mine paying for your time but I'm only an apprentice so I'm not minted.

thanks
Tom
 
You'll be lucky mate! Most areas will make you wait for 5 years before they open it up. You'll also be very lucky to find anyone who will put their ass on the line to state that they feel that an 18 year old with only 6 months experience is safe, especially if they don't know you! Good luck - I think you may need it.
MS
 
Tom,

Not knowing your circumstances, i would think you could do worse than doing DSC1. It has a safety test involved and im sure would satisfy the police. Its probably something you will do eventually anyways and is a good start in your deer stalking life.

How did you get into shooting? Usually your introduced by someone, are they not available for reference? Dont worry about your age. We all have to start somewhere and theres lads younger than you that i know and trust more than fully grown old wise men when it comes to firearms and shotguns.

Best of luck.
 
Got dsc1 already. Firearms have given it to me in writing that once I produce the evidence my condition will be opened. To be honest I got into shooting by myself, dad doesn't shoot and doesn't really like it and his fathers isn't around so it's just been me learning as I go along. Just trying to make it as easy as possible for fox control during lambing as I struggles getting land cleared in time last year
 
You'll be lucky mate! Most areas will make you wait for 5 years before they open it up. You'll also be very lucky to find anyone who will put their ass on the line to state that they feel that an 18 year old with only 6 months experience is safe, especially if they don't know you! Good luck - I think you may need it.
MS


Ms,

got to only, slightly disagree with you there,
from meeting a chap and watching him a few times you will know if he is safe and reliable with a gun.
also to say a guy in your opinion is safe is only valid for the day your with him and is an opinion.
just like an mot, only really valid on the day its issued as any wear and tear after that is not warranted. i cant speak for this young lad but i would happily sign a sheet if i was happy with him, if you go out with him and he is not safe dont sign.
you will meet someone sensible from here one hopes and get the assistance you need, i dont think it will be a five minute meet though as Ms is right they dont know you.

p,
 
Wiling to take as long as someone needs to deem me as safe.

Thanks
tom

now that comment wouldn't fill with me confidence tom, your either safe or not mate. anyone who would do this would not be there to instruct you although they would pass on experiences for you to learn from.
good advise to take dsc1 but again that will not prove your safe but commited.

p,
 
Got my certificate opened up after 9 months, I pointed out to FLO that the DSC1 has a good degree of safety involved and it proved competency. They agreed and opened it straight up, I was 19 at the time. That was 10 years ago mind you but shouldn't change anything!
 
Wiling to take as long as someone needs to deem me as safe.

Thanks
tom

now that comment wouldn't fill with me confidence tom, your either safe or not mate. anyone who would do this would not be there to instruct you although they would pass on experiences for you to learn from.
good advise to take dsc1 but again that will not prove your safe but commited.

p,
Fine if you have the money for dsc1.
Being patient and willing to wait until an experienced stalker gives the thumbs up shows commitment too, he certainly isn't taking the p*ss.

Good luck Tomm

fraser
 
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Ms,

got to only, slightly disagree with you there,
from meeting a chap and watching him a few times you will know if he is safe and reliable with a gun.
also to say a guy in your opinion is safe is only valid for the day your with him and is an opinion.
just like an mot, only really valid on the day its issued as any wear and tear after that is not warranted. i cant speak for this young lad but i would happily sign a sheet if i was happy with him, if you go out with him and he is not safe dont sign.
you will meet someone sensible from here one hopes and get the assistance you need, i dont think it will be a five minute meet though as Ms is right they dont know you.

p,


+ 1, on this, and as spud said, if you we're nearer, I'd be happy to assist, it doesn't sound like you're after sneaking off with someone else's permission, and your comment about taking as long as someone wants in order to feel satisfied, fair play, good luck fella, sure someone will help you out. Ok, so you're six months in, I had an open ticket in that time, I'm not going to judge you on that basis.
DS
 
Don't run before you can walk tomm,not sure what experience you have got but c/f rifles are seriously powerful,when I first got a 22/250 I didn't shoot it out of this big valley on some ground I got until I was confident to do so,I did have a mentor,totally different when you go solo.
 
A proper old fashioned mentor has gotta be the way for this lad to go someone down your way must need some muscle to help shift seats and carcasses ! A dsc1 is great but hard earned hands on experience is what he needs .
come on Cornish stalkers
kind regards
norma
 
It dont make sense to me when you do the dsc1 you can buy a 243 say and you have no experience with firearms,I had air rifles to start with then I got my fac,started with an fac rated air rifle,then several 22lr's,moved on to c/f rifles then,funny thing though is 22lr is still my favourite.
 
As much as I am a fan and supporter of DSC 1, it is such a basic safety and shoot test that to give someone an open ticket for that alone would be laughable.
Mentoring is most definitely the way to go, as long as the mentor is also suitable! There is currently no way to quantify this though. There is an old saying that 'you can't put an old head on young shoulders' which is another way of saying that experience comes with age and time spent on the ground. You can't teach experience!...it comes with time and age.
To put things into perspective here;
A legal limit air rifle can kill a person and is 12 ft/lbs.
A .22LR rimfire can kill a person at over 1km and is about 100ft/lbs
An average deer legal rifle is about 2000 ft/lbs and can kill a person out to about 5kms!!!!!!
That kind of equipment demands an awful lot of respect and knowledge from the user which generally comes with experience.
If you think that every bullet you fire stops at your backstop, then you are very much mistaken! Get yourself down to a military range at night and watch them fire tracer rounds into a 45 degree sand bank and see what happens! You will see rounds fired into what you would assume to be the ultimate backstop going up to several hundred feet in the air! Then consider your muddy field full of stones at much less of an angle and consider where your bullet may end up! Backstop is a misleading term and could also be called velocity reducer and direction changer!
An open ticket gives someone the decision as to whether land is safe to shoot on without police advice. This is a massive amount of trust to place in a person and the safety of all of us depends upon it! I don't believe that a young person who has only held a firearm certificate for 6 months and has not been mentored is competent to make such judgement. I appreciate that the request for mentoring has now been made, but I can fully understand why this has been insisted upon.
MS
 
I had my ticket opened after 9 months with C/F which I was very pleased with but I do also have a job with some responsibilities and also plenty of H&S qualifications as well as a lot of experience and expert mentoring in a short time. I also had rimfires before.

Honestly I think the guidelines are there for a reason because Suffolk especially is very flat...

But if you are safe and experience d enough then I hope you find someone to sign for you :)
 
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tomm dont know where you are in the county but youre welcome to come down here with me for a couple of trial trips i dont do deer im a foxer with a bit of corvid an rabbit bashing for good measure and i am way down west pm me if its any help to ya foxxer
 
As much as I am a fan and supporter of DSC 1, it is such a basic safety and shoot test that to give someone an open ticket for that alone would be laughable.
Mentoring is most definitely the way to go, as long as the mentor is also suitable! There is currently no way to quantify this though. There is an old saying that 'you can't put an old head on young shoulders' which is another way of saying that experience comes with age and time spent on the ground. You can't teach experience!...it comes with time and age.
To put things into perspective here;
A legal limit air rifle can kill a person and is 12 ft/lbs.
A .22LR rimfire can kill a person at over 1km and is about 100ft/lbs
An average deer legal rifle is about 2000 ft/lbs and can kill a person out to about 5kms!!!!!!
That kind of equipment demands an awful lot of respect and knowledge from the user which generally comes with experience.
If you think that every bullet you fire stops at your backstop, then you are very much mistaken! Get yourself down to a military range at night and watch them fire tracer rounds into a 45 degree sand bank and see what happens! You will see rounds fired into what you would assume to be the ultimate backstop going up to several hundred feet in the air! Then consider your muddy field full of stones at much less of an angle and consider where your bullet may end up! Backstop is a misleading term and could also be called velocity reducer and direction changer!
An open ticket gives someone the decision as to whether land is safe to shoot on without police advice. This is a massive amount of trust to place in a person and the safety of all of us depends upon it! I don't believe that a young person who has only held a firearm certificate for 6 months and has not been mentored is competent to make such judgement. I appreciate that the request for mentoring has now been made, but I can fully understand why this has been insisted upon.
MS


Whilst I agree with the general content of your post,I fail to see how a "closed cert" has any influence over the safety aspects of a shooter in any way......

I would be very interested to hear and try to understand the theory behind it as it seems to be a technical condition of little or no value........
 
No land can be deemed suitable or unsuitable... It's quite possible to take a safe shot on a school playing field, and on the same day take an unsafe shot on a 3000acre estate.
It's the person with the finger on the trigger that needs to be deemed suitable, not the land.

The whole closed/open debate rages on... it's flawed at every stage, but what else could they do apart from give every new applicant an open ticket?
 
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