Deer disturbance

Joehuck

Well-Known Member
Have had a pretty poor season on the reds so far (rut and hinds) not seen a single deer. Feeling a bit disheartened I placed two trail cameras in the usual locations.....plenty of pictures but they are feeding just before it gets light(gone back into woods by dawn) and just after it has gone dark. Would this be to do with pressures from Humans or is anyone else experiencing similar. Cheers.
 
I'd suspect pressure from disturbance by humans I'm afraid. Can you get a seat up in the woods and intercept them as they come back off the open ground?
 
I'm afraid I can't put a seat up the land I have is surrounded by FC land on two sides then open fell ground on the other. Flushing the, isn't an option eith because of the above plus I'm not over keen on it.
 
I'm afraid I can't put a seat up the land I have is surrounded by FC land on two sides then open fell ground on the other. Flushing the, isn't an option eith because of the above plus I'm not over keen on it.

Is it me being synical but I think you've just identified where your disturbance has come from!
I suspect many of the deer on your patch are passing between your bordering land and yours and on 2 sides have probably been hammered. Just my opinion
Wingy
 
That's probably the case I wouldn't like to think they are just trying to wipe them out. Though rumours I have heard suggest they may be doing just that in other parts of their land in the area.
 
The reds have taken a battering all the way up from south cumbria, if its not poachers ,its the F.C lads on a shoot on sight policy, grizedale is virtually devoid of deer due to the hammering they have had over the last 2 years.
holker and graywaite are down on deer numbers as well.
the reds were starting to make progress around ennerdale as well, but the F.C are killing everything to make sure they don't get a foot hold ,this is down to the "wild ennerdale policy" so trees come first.
 
That's sad. Wild ennerdale. You would think that they would promote them not wipe them out. I know I like stalking them but I also like to see them in the wild. The FC policy doesn't sound like managing deer to me. There is hardly any point in me picking older ones etc when chances are the ones I leave will be taken as part of their culling.
 
Difficult situation if indeed there is a shoot on sight policy by the FC. It certainly sounds like any good work you do in trying to be selective about your kills is going to be undone by the work of the FC.

I do most of my Red deer stalking in Austria in a mountainous well forested area with fairly large volumes of disturbance and as you mentioned before most of the deer come out just as it gets dark or in the dark and disappear again before first light. One option we use to good effect in particular on hinds/calves in Oct/Nov/Dec is to go out at full moon to an area where we know they have been feeding in regular. I believe we have to apply for this at the authorities but alot of Gamekeepers/Stalkers in Austria including my cousin use this option to meet their cull targets.

Not sure where the law here stands on doing that but may be an option. We also have a camera and nothing more frustrating then seeing them on camera and going out for hours and not seeing a single beast. Good luck.
 
If I'm right in saying over here we can only shoot one hour after sundown so the moonlight shooting won't be an option. I only take a couple each year to keep the farmer happy so I'm not hamstrung by quotas etc. I was just wondering if anyone had experienced the same sort of thing.. Thank you all for your replies.
 
I placed two trail cameras in the usual locations.....plenty of pictures but they are feeding just before it gets light(gone back into woods by dawn) and just after it has gone dark.

hardly sounds like they have been wiped out if you are getting plenty of pictures. Welcome to the ecology of red deer. If you have fields bordered by forestry where do you think the deer are going to feel safer during the daylight hours? In the open or in cover?

Seems to me that every time someone perceives a lack of deer it is automatically either poachers or the FC rangers, I replied similarly to a thread a few months back where someone had spent a weekend in Thetford forest, not seen any deer and then decided the FC had killed them all!
 
I haven't once said they have been wiped out in my area! I was merely asking if anyone else had experienced the same. Also I posted this thread as over the past year their feeding patterns have changed. I (2years ago) was able to view them through the daylight hours. They have been poached as well guts have been found in nature reserves in the area.
 
That's probably the case I wouldn't like to think they are just trying to wipe them out. Though rumours I have heard suggest they may be doing just that in other parts of their land in the area.

rumours I have heard suggest they may be doing just that in other parts of their land in the area.

That's sad. Wild ennerdale. You would think that they would promote them not wipe them out. I know I like stalking them but I also like to see them in the wild. The FC policy doesn't sound like managing deer to me. There is hardly any point in me picking older ones etc when chances are the ones I leave will be taken as part of their culling.

I must have misread.
 
Thanks. Quotes that you have copied don't say they are being wiped out on my land just in the area (being Cumbria). Can't believe it has turned into this all I was asking for was a bit of advice.

Regards
 
Hi Joe,
This is my first post!!

Sorry it looks like the thread is taking a swerve off course. Unfortunately you mentioned FC. From my long time viewing this forum there is a lot of hating goes on here, and what has been said needs to be taken with a pinch of salt from my experience. Opinions on FC activities seem, in the main, to be born of speculation, prejudice, or both. I'm local to you and have no idea from your OP where your ground is, so for posters to give you the cause to your problem when they aren't even based in the county tells you something. Even the one who is, I would say, is wide of the mark.

Reasons for changing patterns are many and varied and can be due to effects a long way from your ground, especially with reds. My advice to you would be go along to the next local Deer Management Group meeting and talk to other stalkers in your area to hear what their experiences are. The FC rangers should also be there. Talk to them and ask questions, voice your concerns and hear it from the horse's mouth. If you can't wait and are concerned enough contact the office at Grizedale and ask to speak to the ranger covering your area, I'm sure they will be more than happy to talk to you as I have always found them approachable and helpful in the past.

To answer you more directly, I too have noticed less sign of reds locally (south Lakes), compared to last year when they seemed to be almost everywhere in number and in places not normally seen. But they are still about. Mild weather, increasing disturbance (we are in the centre of 'Adventure Capital of Britain'), and short day light hours at this time of year will all be playing a part. Also, I have found, from the few I've shot so far this year, that both red and roe are in excellent condition despite the poor summer. I can't remember seeing so much fat in animals at this time of year before. So basically their need to feed in daylight is much reduced (not to mention winter inappetance).

With regard exact location of your ground, I'd keep it under your hat on the public forum. If it's producing heads like the one in your photos word has it the No.1 local poacher has a 'thing' for big heads, and you don't want him on your ground, or the deer really will disappear!

Regards
Wolfie
 
Lupus, thanks for your reply its been the most helpful and sensible one received. The sort of thing I was expecting from the start. As far as heads go the best ones which I have been leaving have since moved on. There are two following at the moment with very poor heads one a switch and one with a busted pair of antlers. I will be keeping it under my hat hopefully. Thanks again. Oh and I have been told of Cumbria deer stalkers but I have no contact details as I would be more than happy to attend these groups.
 
Hi Joe,
This is my first post!!

Sorry it looks like the thread is taking a swerve off course. Unfortunately you mentioned FC. From my long time viewing this forum there is a lot of hating goes on here, and what has been said needs to be taken with a pinch of salt from my experience. Opinions on FC activities seem, in the main, to be born of speculation, prejudice, or both. I'm local to you and have no idea from your OP where your ground is, so for posters to give you the cause to your problem when they aren't even based in the county tells you something. Even the one who is, I would say, is wide of the mark.

Reasons for changing patterns are many and varied and can be due to effects a long way from your ground, especially with reds. My advice to you would be go along to the next local Deer Management Group meeting and talk to other stalkers in your area to hear what their experiences are. The FC rangers should also be there. Talk to them and ask questions, voice your concerns and hear it from the horse's mouth. If you can't wait and are concerned enough contact the office at Grizedale and ask to speak to the ranger covering your area, I'm sure they will be more than happy to talk to you as I have always found them approachable and helpful in the past.

To answer you more directly, I too have noticed less sign of reds locally (south Lakes), compared to last year when they seemed to be almost everywhere in number and in places not normally seen. But they are still about. Mild weather, increasing disturbance (we are in the centre of 'Adventure Capital of Britain'), and short day light hours at this time of year will all be playing a part. Also, I have found, from the few I've shot so far this year, that both red and roe are in excellent condition despite the poor summer. I can't remember seeing so much fat in animals at this time of year before. So basically their need to feed in daylight is much reduced (not to mention winter inappetance).

With regard exact location of your ground, I'd keep it under your hat on the public forum. If it's producing heads like the one in your photos word has it the No.1 local poacher has a 'thing' for big heads, and you don't want him on your ground, or the deer really will disappear!

Regards
Wolfie


I certainly don;t have any prejudice or hatedred for the F.C or any other deer related group, my comments were born from experiance and having friends who manage deer in the lake district all saying the same thing, yes there are many reasons why deer numbers fluctuate and this must be added to the equation but activities carried out at grisdale and other F.C owned areas over the last couple of years has made a big impact on numbers, facter in the poaching element and you have a problem......FACT not myth or legend.

And as for no1 poacher He no longer has a thing for heads cause he was killed last year, although there is plenty around who will pick up his crown.
 
joe your problem in the lakes is not a new one i did my L2 many years ago in the lakes chap that took me out told me the reds were vertually nocternal back then we were out before first light one morning and did see some but they were making for cover in the mosses before it was light enough to shoot. nowadays they walk them out of cover to guns in high seats once a year as far as I know.not much help to you im afraid.
 
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