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Thread: Legal Weapons in the UK (Scotland)

  1. #1

    Question Legal Weapons in the UK (Scotland)

    I had thought I understood what weapons were legal and not legal, in the UK, but after reading some threads on this site, I am no longer sure. I will give the weapons I have and ask that someone, please, tell me which ones I need to get rid of, before I move to Scotland.

    Rifles:

    30.06 Springfield, Bolt Action
    30.40 Craig, Bolt Action
    8mmx57, Bold Action
    .303 British Enfield, Bold Action
    .22, Bolt Action

    Shotguns:

    16 Ga, Double Barrel, side-by-side, with external side hammers
    12 Ga, Double Barrel, Over and Under

    Pistols:

    .357 Mag, Ruger Blackhawk, Single Action, Revolver, 7.5 inch barrel
    .44 Black Power, Single Action, Revolver, 8 inch barrel
    .22 Semi-Auto, Wather, 6 inch barrel
    .32 Semi-Auto, Melor, 4 inch barrel

    I believe the two Semi-Autos have to go, but I would like to know about the others.

    Thank you, in advance

    Grant

  2. #2
    You will need to leave your handguns at home.

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by BearStalker View Post
    I had thought I understood what weapons were legal and not legal, in the UK, but after reading some threads on this site, I am no longer sure. I will give the weapons I have and ask that someone, please, tell me which ones I need to get rid of, before I move to Scotland.

    Rifles:

    30.06 Springfield, Bolt Action
    30.40 Craig, Bolt Action
    8mmx57, Bold Action
    .303 British Enfield, Bold Action
    .22, Bolt Action

    Shotguns:

    16 Ga, Double Barrel, side-by-side, with external side hammers
    12 Ga, Double Barrel, Over and Under

    Pistols:

    .357 Mag, Ruger Blackhawk, Single Action, Revolver, 7.5 inch barrel
    .44 Black Power, Single Action, Revolver, 8 inch barrel
    .22 Semi-Auto, Wather, 6 inch barrel
    .32 Semi-Auto, Melor, 4 inch barrel

    I believe the two Semi-Autos have to go, but I would like to know about the others.

    Thank you, in advance

    Grant

    Ballistic requirements in Scotland, for deer. You must use expanding bullets only on deer.

    The "little" Roe deer regulations:
    Minimum muzzle velocity 2,450 feet per second, minimum muzzle energy 1,000 ft/lbs, minimum bullet weight 50 grains.

    The "large" Red, Fallow and Sika deer regulations:
    Minimum muzzle velocity 2,450 feet per second, minimum muzzle energu 1,750 ft/lbs, minimum bullet weight 100 grains.

    Other regulations apply in other parts of the UK.

  4. #4
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    Quote Originally Posted by howa243 View Post
    You will need to leave your handguns at home.
    If he's a member of a gun/target club he can have the Black powder revolver... can't he?

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    Owning non deer legal calibres isn't something I know very much about but .22lr and .22hornets and many other small bore options are allowed for "vermin" control.

    Target shooters will likely come along and tell you whats what in that field but I do know that much more seems to be allowed for paper punching and gong bashing than for deer.

  6. #6
    You need 'good reason' for each firearm. You can have as many shotguns as you can securely store.

    In simple terms pistols are section 5 prohibited weapons. Here is a simple link that links on the the legislation

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm..._2%29_Act_1997

    If I remember correctly a 'long barreled revolver needs a total length of 24"

    Section 161 of the Highways Act 1980 (England & Wales) makes it an offence to discharge a firearm within 50 ft of the centre of a highway with vehicular rights without lawful authority or excuse, if as a result a user of the highway is injured, interrupted or endangered.

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by BearStalker View Post
    I had thought I understood what weapons were legal and not legal, in the UK, but after reading some threads on this site, I am no longer sure. I will give the weapons I have and ask that someone, please, tell me which ones I need to get rid of, before I move to Scotland.

    UK FIREARMS LAW (EXCEPT FOR NORTHERN IRELAND) IS ESSENTIALLY UNIFORM. SAME LAW IN SCOTLAND AS IN ENGLAND AND WALES IN RESPECT OF THE FIREARMS. ONLY DIFFERENT LAW FOR WHAT BULLET WEIGHT, SIZE, VELOCITY IS "DEER LEGAL" AND NOT "DEER LEGAL"

    Rifles:

    30.06 Springfield, Bolt Action OK IN THE UK
    30.40 Craig, Bolt Action KRAG? OK IN THE UK. PROBABLY WITH REGARDS VELOCITY NOT DEER LEGAL.
    8mmx57, Bold Action OK IN THE UK
    .303 British Enfield, Bold Action OK IN THE UK. PROBABLY WITH 215 GRAIN BULLETS WITH REGARDS VELOCITY NOT DEER LEGAL
    .22, Bolt Action OK IN THE UK. NOT DEER LEGAL

    Shotguns:

    16 Ga, Double Barrel, side-by-side, with external side hammers OK IN THE UK IF BARRELS OVER 24" IN LENGTH
    12 Ga, Double Barrel, Over and Under OK IN THE UK IF BARRELS OVER 24" IN LENGTH

    Pistols:

    .357 Mag, Ruger Blackhawk, Single Action, Revolver, 7.5 inch barrel SECTION 5 AUTHORITY. NOT USUALLY PERMITTED. CLASSED AS A "PROHIBITED WEAPON" SINCE 1997
    .44 Black Power, Single Action, Revolver, 8 inch barrel OK IN THE UK IF IS A MUZZLE LOADING REVOLVER SUCH AS REMINGTON 1858 REPLICA or COLT 1860 REPLICA.
    .22 Semi-Auto, Wather, 6 inch barrel SECTION 5 AUTHORITY. NOT USUALLY PERMITTED. CLASSED AS A "PROHIBITED WEAPON" SINCE 1997
    .32 Semi-Auto, Melor, 4 inch barrel SECTION 5 AUTHORITY. NOT USUALLY PERMITTED. CLASSED AS A "PROHIBITED WEAPON" SINCE 1997

    I believe the two Semi-Autos have to go, but I would like to know about the others.

    SADLY ALL THE HANDGUNS ON YOUR LIST (WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE BLACKPOWDER REVOLVER IF IT IS MUZZLE LOADING) HAVE TO GO

    Thank you, in advance

    Grant
    Now it also gets complicated! You have to have a Licence for these items. A Firearm Certificate for the rifled arms, including the muzzle loading revolver, and a Shot Gun Certificate for the shot guns. You will need to show adequate secure storage (usually a steel cabinet) for all of them AND for the rifled arms in addition a "good reason" that you need them.

    This "good reason" can ONLY be either memberships of a shooting club at which those rifled arms can be used.

    A target rifle club even if the rifles are "hunting" rifles rather than, say a 1903 Springfield, and a club at which the muzzle loading revolver can be used. Which may be one and the same club. FOR THAT TARGET SHOOTING YOU WILL NOT BE PERMITTED OTHER THAN FMJ OR CAST LEAD BULLETS OF NON-EXPANDING TYPE.

    Or, for the rifles, "hunting", which may be your own land, or a booked day on an estate, or a rented shooting right over someone else's land. Without that you will not be granted permission to use them for "hunting".

    rifles can be given permission by the police for both target shooting AND "hunting" but it is unlikely that they will give it for the 30-40 Krag or the 303 Lee Enfield unless you specifically state that. For some reason the police assume that no-one actually goes "hunting" here in UK with unmodified, iron sighted, ex-military surplus rifles!

    That they do, a lot, in the USA I know!

    It may also be prudent to join the British Association for Shooting and Conservation. Others may say join this, that, or the other but BASC has its own "hunting" that you can book by the day and most police forces accept that as your "hunting" "good reason". It also has a good legal advice team on firearms issues.

    Best of Luck!

    If it were me I'd stay in the USA if I had the choice! There's no PUBLIC HUNTING LAND here in the UK so unlike in the USA you just can't go out and wander about in state owned forests etc., etc.. You will have to "pay to play" if you want to shoot deer!

  8. #8
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    Thanks for that link Apache, it confirms what I thought... Muzzle loading "black powder" handguns are still OK for target shooting

    What you link does not say is... Possession of black powder requires an explosives permit as well as a Firearms Certificate. Possession of pyrodex and smokeless propellants, on the other hand, does not require an explosives permit.

  9. #9
    The question was "what can I legally hold".

    The handguns are a no no I'm afraid. They come under what are known as "section five" weapons, which are prohibited weapons under the firearms act 1988.

    The link should give you most of the information you need, if you have the time to sit, read and digest.

    All of the rifles are items that CAN be held on a firearms certificate. They are classed as "section one" weapons (again, named for the section of the firearms act that they come under). However, the fact that they can be held legally, does not mean you will be able to hold them.

    In British firearms law, we have this concept called "good reason" to hold any given firearm. We also have universal registration and draconian control on the movement of firearms between individuals and by trade.

    Before you can legally possess a firearm in the UK, you will require some kind of authorisation to hold. For a resident this will normally be in the form of a firearms certificate, for rifles and similar weapons, and a shotgun certificate for all shotguns, which are classed as "smooth bored firearms with a barrel diameter of less than two inches"

    Now, for firearms held under a section one firearm certificate (basically anything with a rifled barrel that's not a hand gun) you will need to prove that you have good reason to hold that particular weapon before they will grant you permission to acquire that caliber of weapon (ok, they usually state the cartridge rather than the caliber, poorly drafted legislation). The particular good reason that you put forward may limit the uses that you can put the rifles to. For example, if you put down membership of a target club as good reason, then you will only be able to use that rifle on a range. If you have land to shoot over then you may get the rifle conditioned for shooting various species of target animal.

    To explain the British firearms law would take many a long page. I'm afraid it will come as quite a culture shock to you after the US. What I've put above begins to give you an idea of the hoops you will be forced to jump through. The whole licensing system is the reason many of us have recommended either leaving the guns in secure storage in the States until you've got the relevant certificates, or bring them over and have them stored at an RFD (Registered Firearms Dealer). If the rifles are held legally in Germany then they should have CIP proofing, which means they can be sold in the UK.

    My advice is to spnd as much time as you can reading and familiarising yourself with the various documents that govern firearms, their ownership and use in the UK. Any description on here is necessarily going to be incomplete, and in this could be dangerously misleading. Things we take for granted, a US gun user, used to the much less controlled gun environment wouldn't even think of.

    Talking to the shooting organisations is also a useful step. It gives you a knowledgable point of reference for those finer points when necessary, and a voice to help you out if things get sticky.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Tamus View Post
    If he's a member of a gun/target club he can have the Black powder revolver... can't he?
    Guess so. Just cant see it happening. Am assuming the time scales are not long here.

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