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Thread: Beaters and Pickers-Up. Any clear guidance?

  1. #1

    Beaters and Pickers-Up. Any clear guidance?

    Yesterday an eNewsletter was issued from Guns-on-Pegs that appeared to state that Beaters cannot be deemed as Self-Employed - HMRC has apparently made this clear. This seems to contradict the current inconclusive advice from a number of organisation (NGO, BASC, CA, GMCT et al.) and what we believed to be a way forward by treating them as self-employed.

    There is still no real clarity on how shoots are to deal with beaters and pickers-up, has anyone who is running a shoot got any clear guidance and satisfactory solution as to how they are going to deal with this?

    Please, please, please do not use this thread as an excuse to castigate HMRC or taxation generally or a lack of guidance from any organisation (as a similar thread on this topic appears to have degenerated into). This is a serious issue and I would prefer it discussed as such.

  2. #2
    Our shoot is a non commercial family farm shoot ,my boss collects off his regular guns monies for the beaters each shoot ,I then pay the beaters .on two large shoots I visit it is also still up in the air as to what will happen this season .myself and my mate would still visit as we get the stalking for nothing so don't want paying anyways ,it's going to be tricky what ever happens .
    good post chap and like you hope a Sencible debate ensues .

  3. #3
    Thanks Norma,
    I'm hoping to discuss this subject next week at the CLA Game Fair, hopefully there will be some useful input from this thread as background information. With the number of commercial shoots in the UK, I would hope that there will be clear guidance soon.
    It is oddly satisfying that the two large shoots you mention are still unsure - at least it's not just me!

  4. #4
    Presumably the beaters are in `gainful employment` elsewhere for the rest of the week.
    If so their payment for such extra activities would I believe be taxable and should be declared by the recipient.
    I can see similar problems popping up with paid helpers at clay shoots for example.


  5. #5
    Not necessarily stag.
    Naturally, each beater and picker-up will have different circumstances - the Saturday/holiday beater who is still at school, the retired, pensioners, part-timers, self-employed within the industry, some who beat on other shoots, some who don't, keepers form neighbouring shoots etc, etc. The main issue seems to be whether the individual is an employee or self-employed and whether the work can be deemed as casual.
    Various shooting organisations appear to be stating that it is the shoot owners responsibility to satisfy themselves whether each individual is employee/self-employed. However, the Guns-on-Pegs article appears to contradict this as it states that the HMRC haver stipulated that a beater is an employee and cannot be deemed as self-employed.

  6. #6
    a lot of the commercial shoots will loose half there beating team as most are on the dole

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by see it shoot it View Post
    a lot of the commercial shoots will loose half there beating team as most are on the dole
    is this a fact ?

  8. #8
    Some beaters will be on the dole for sure but the vast majority of ours were retired or had taken holidays from their employment to beat.
    The thing that worries me is that a lot of beaters only get their expenses covered with their beating money and if they are to pay tax on that it may lead to them being out of pocket.A rise in beating money may lead to less beaters being taken on making life a little harder for keepers to present their birds on shoot days.And then there is the minimum wage issue!

  9. #9
    i still have no direction on this ,as a beater who is on med retirment due to injury no one can say yes or no i don't get job seekers as i'am as thay say unfit for my role ? and trying to get retrained at 53 is like asking to see your own doctor!! my shoot has told me as it is some farmers who own and just do it cos thay can we get paid out of pocket and our ni numbers will not be put farward, as this is as per thay have been told ! so if the shoots are being told one thing and hmrc are saying something diff how the hell is it going to work in 13+ weeks time

    NB: If you look at from the otherway anti shooting game birds what better way to put an end to our sporting rights
    Last edited by paul o'; 09-07-2013 at 12:58.

  10. #10
    thats it Paul o its a suck it and see for those of us on the being paid side. We have a small farm syndicate where it won't make a difference as that is paid on the day by the guns and then another which is 20 odd days which I guess will also be working out what to do. I get the idea its a huge red herring lots of noise by the revenue to try and get people to do it voluntarily and those who carry on as before will not hear anything about it. The last thing they want is to open the door for everyone to claim expenses

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