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Thread: C.O.l limit

  1. #1

    C.O.l limit

    Hi all

    I recently started reloading. 308 caliber, bought hornady single action press with Redding deluxe die set.

    i am struggling to achieve the c.o.l listed in the hornady manual of 2.735'' for the honady 150gr interbond head. All my cases trimmed to 2.008''.

    I set the main part of the die as it touches the case shoulder and adjust the top pin as low as it will go and 2.742''is about the lowest it will press the head in.

    am I doing something daft? Any help appreciated, go easy on me, only just started!

    ​pricey.

  2. #2
    Have you screwed the die down until it just bumps the holder?
    Below is a link to my website.
    Quad sticks

  3. #3
    Pricey

    The seating die is set up without a case in the shellholder. Can I suggest you read the Redding seating die instructions again?

    http://www.redding-reloading.com/tech-line-a-tips-faqs/168-working-with-your-competition-seating-die

    If you Google, there's more info.

    Regards

    ​JCS

  4. #4
    As the others say first check that your die is set up properly. Lower the press handle so the ram is at the top then screw the die down until it touches the shellholder, then back off 1/2 to 3/4 of a turn. Then screw the lock ring down and tighten the grub screw. Then try seating a bullet in an empty and unprimed case and see if you can get the length correct.
    If you cant then it could be a mismatch between the dies and shellholder. To be honest you may not need to seat the bullet any deeper depending on the geometry of your particular chamber and throat area. There are several ways to measure the maximum seating depth, but basically so long as the bullet is not jammed in the rifling and not too long to fit in the magazine then you could set the die to seat as close as you can get to the book length without getting unduly concerned. As always start with a low charge of powder and work up

  5. #5
    Thanks you for the replies. Yes, I was setting the die up incorrectly.

    what I have noticed tonight is if I set the die so it touches the shell holder and back it off a 1/4 - 1/2 turn, initially the dies seems to give the shoulder a slightly rounder appearance than when taken straight out of the fl resizing die (as if The case is being compressed). So if I back off a bit more on the die to the point where this roundedness stops, the bullet seating adjustment makes no difference to the overall length and I can't still get near the 2.735'' recommended overall length.

    Thanks again for your help, think it will be easier to demonstrate to the guys at the range on Saturday.

    pricey

  6. #6
    Pricey

    I've just had a quick look at a couple of my dies. Try setting the micrometer top to about 3 on the vertical scale.

    Regards

    ​JCS

  7. #7
    In nearly 20 years of reloading I've never once looked at the COL in the book!

    My seating depth procedure works like this: back the seating thingy on the die out until it only just seats the bullet, see if it fits in the magazine. Adjust as required. Now see if the round chambers easily, if it won't then adjust it till it does. Measure and note. Done.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by Pricey View Post
    Thanks you for the replies. Yes, I was setting the die up incorrectly.

    what I have noticed tonight is if I set the die so it touches the shell holder and back it off a 1/4 - 1/2 turn, initially the dies seems to give the shoulder a slightly rounder appearance than when taken straight out of the fl resizing die (as if The case is being compressed). So if I back off a bit more on the die to the point where this roundedness stops, the bullet seating adjustment makes no difference to the overall length and I can't still get near the 2.735'' recommended overall length.
    The seating die in the Redding deluxe set is a standard die, not the competition version with the micrometer top.

    It has a crimp ring inside. If the die is adjusted too close to the shellholder then the crimp ring will press on the mouth of the case neck and try to crimp it. If your bullet does not have a cannelure for the crimp then the case neck will be forced back, causing the shoulder to be distorted, as you have noticed.

    For most rifle ammo a crimp formed this way is not required, nor desirable.

    The seating die will never touch the shoulder, I think it is the crimp ring touching the end of the neck that is causing your problem.

    The best way to set up a standard seating die is to put an empty case into the shellholder, raise the ram, then screw the die into the press with finger pressure until you feel it snug up onto the case. At this point the crimp ring inside the die is just touching the end of the neck. Now back the die off about 1/4 turn and lock it up. You have now set the die up as low as possible in the press, without causing any crimp.

    Now you can set up the seating depth by screwing in the adjuster bit by bit as you seat a bullet, measuring each time.

    If you still cannot achieve your desired seating depth with the adjuster screwed all the way in, this suggests the seating plug of your die is not compatible with your chosen bullet. I suppose Redding might be able to supply a longer one.

    If you have a complete round which has correct OAL, e.g. a factory round or a dummy (I always keep a dummy round with correct OAL after developing a load) you can set up the seating adjuster almost exactly, first time.

    Back off the seating adjuster, put the dummy round in the press and close it, now screw down the seating adjuster until you feel it snug up onto the bullet in the dummy round. It should now be almost exactly correct. If cautious, back it off a fraction of a turn, then make the final adjustment whilst measuring.

    In lee Deluxe die sets they supply a special "dead length" seating die which does not have a crimp ring. This die is designed to bottom out against the shellholder, taking up any slop in the press, and meaning it can be fitted and re-fitted without any further adjustment.

    You can achieve the same effect with a standard seating die by putting a steel washer or two over the case to take up the gap between the bottom of the die and the shellholder, so that it bottoms out before the crimp ring touches the case mouth. Use the same washer each time and you won't need to adjust the die each time you fit it.

    FWIW Lee full length dies are designed with the same principle, they set the shoulder correctly when bottomed out on the (Lee) shellholder. This is an excellent feature, but if used with another manufacturer's shellholder which may be of different thickness it can cause difficulties.

  9. #9
    Shell holder thickness is often said to be an issue but the thickness cannot be the issue. It's the depth at which the groove for the cases rim is cut from the top face WHICH is the issue and does vary how far the case can be run into the die.

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by Brithunter View Post
    Shell holder thickness is often said to be an issue but the thickness cannot be the issue. It's the depth at which the groove for the cases rim is cut from the top face WHICH is the issue and does vary how far the case can be run into the die.
    Quite correct. Its the thickness of the shellholder rim that matters.

    FWIW, Lee control this dimension very precisely, I've measured my six Lee shellholders and they are all 0.125" +/- 0.0005", the limit of resolution of my digital calipers.

    I have no other manufacturers' shellholders to measure for comparison.

    All of my Lee dies set the shoulder exactly to spec. when bottomed out on their proper shellholders. It is a very convenient design feature.

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