A new Lil Gun favorite.

Muir

Well-Known Member
Much has been written and said about Hodgdon's Lil Gun in the .22 Hornet. If there is a better powder for that cartridge, I haven't seen it yet. Lately though, I have been experimenting with Lil Gun in straight walled pistol cases; specifically the 357 Magnum and have pronounced it, with few reservations, a very good powder for that cartridge, indeed.

This evening I revisited my Model 27 S&W, eight and three-eights incher using Hornady 158 grain XTP bullets and the starting charge of Lil Gun which is 16.0 grains for a listed 1504 fps. (Hodgdon's data is from a 10" barrel which I'm certain is a pressure gun barrel, not a revolver.) Accuracy was as good as I could hold. My 25M groups ranged from 1.3" to 2.4" standing. My 50M groups ranged from 3.2 to 4", again, standing... and this includes the ones that 'got away' from me because i can never get used to how exquisite the trigger is on this revolver. Accuracy is excellent, but that is secondary to the ballistic qualities.

Hodgdon lists the pressure as 24.1K CUP for the load I used. Maximum charge is 18.0 grains with a pressure of 25.8K CUP. A quick look at the two powders bracketing Lil Gun in the lists show max pressures at 43K and 42K CUP respectively. That is a huge difference! Velocities are so close between the three that there is no practical difference between them on that count. The down side of this load is it being somewhat smokey at this pressure level. I'm hoping that increasing the load will stop some of that. As it stands, I can verify that it is a snappy load and judging from the trajectory. I'm getting around 1400+ fps from this revolver. When the weather dries up I'll chronograph it.

I had great accuracy, easy extraction, and I'm certain my cases are going to last a while. Some of you lever gun shooters might want to take note. Judging from the fireball I was getting around sunset, this powder would appreciate a 20" barrel! ;)~Muir
 
As an aside what is considered the shelf life of modern powders such as Lil-Gun if stored at a consistent room temp?

If they stopped making this powder life with a Hornet would not be the same.

K
 
As an aside what is considered the shelf life of modern powders such as Lil-Gun if stored at a consistent room temp?

If they stopped making this powder life with a Hornet would not be the same.

K

Would make little difference to me, I have used both this and H110 for the 35 grain v-max and get far better results as for as velocity goes
and group size is also better with H110.
That does change when the bullets go up to 45 grains, but it is still pretty good with H110, but velocity drops off a bit compared to Lil'Gun.
I have wondered from time to time if Lil'Gun would work in 7.62x39, but not having found any data, and not being abloe to run quick load
that is as far as I have got with that.

Neil. :)
 
Would make little difference to me, I have used both this and H110 for the 35 grain v-max and get far better results as for as velocity goes
and group size is also better with H110.
That does change when the bullets go up to 45 grains, but it is still pretty good with H110, but velocity drops off a bit compared to Lil'Gun.
I have wondered from time to time if Lil'Gun would work in 7.62x39, but not having found any data, and not being abloe to run quick load
that is as far as I have got with that.

Neil. :)
\


....and way higher pressures.
As to shelf life: I have some 1970 vintage IMR 4064 that I'm still shooting.~Muir
 
Very likely, but with well over 20 reloads of 11.5 grains (of H110) and so far never needed full length sizing I have to ask if it really matters ?

Neil. :)

You are getting very much more pressure. (about 30%) Does it matter? Probably not, and I like H110 as well. (H110, Accurate 1680, and Lil Gun= top Hornet powders) I just load to pressure these days. I will sacrifice a few fps for a significant reduction in pressure.~Muir
 
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You are getting very much more pressure. (about 30%) Does it matter? Probably not, and I like H110 as well. (H110, Accurate 1680, and Lil Gun= top Hornet powders) I just load to pressure these days. I will sacrifice a few fps for a significant reduction in pressure.~Muir

Me too 'Muir'... I load 12.9 gr of that dust fine powder under the 35gr V-Max bullets in both the final .22 K- Hornet rounds AND for the fire-forming loads in new .22 Hornet brass. Both shoot exceptionally tight groups with good velocities too boot.... Great powder once loaded but it does NOT go well in my trickler, bye-passing the screw mechanism and coming out onto the worktop!? So it is a bit of a pain metering out the loads one at a time from a Lee Powder Scoop, but the results on firing warrant the extra time and faff imho......

ATB ....... and shoot safely
 
Apologies for resurrecting this thread, but the subject is pertinent today. Hornet6 is discussing loading the 22 hornet whereas the OP was reloading 357 magnum pistol carts.
In the latter instance pressure is extremely relevant. Hornet chambered guns are built to withstand this pressure (with H110) revolvers and lever action rifles are certainly not.
I can only speak for my own experience but with my win 94 chambered in 357 mag, lil gun can be loaded to give me muzzle velocities in excess of 2000 fps, this with a hard cast powder coated 158 grn rnfp bullets without any problems with extraction, which, due to the flimsiness of the rifles' extraction system, is the first thing to indicate excessive pressures.
These loads, albeit de-tuned to 1800 fps, give me a legal option for muntjac subject to agreement by my FO. The upper limit of pressure on a rifle like mine in vgc is around 42000 psi. TBH I just wanted to prove it could be done, I've a 223 and a 308 which are my go to rifles for deer, as appropriate.
Please note I have omitted the actual amount of powder that I have used as whilst I'm happy with it in my rifle I can't even begin to judge yours - I think the powder coated bullets are easier to shove down the barrel so I cannot stress highly enough that lubed lead, copper washed, fmjs and jacketed soft point bullets have not been tested by me with this powder.
On a 100 yard range the difference between the factory remington ammo and these handloads is significant, factory loads go bang and smack, for my reloads remove the "and".
 
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