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Thread: Calibres and land deemed suitable?

  1. #1

    Calibres and land deemed suitable?

    Just wondering if this map exists? or is it the police just using this as excuse?

    James

  2. #2

    Re: Calibres and land deemed suitable?

    Quote Originally Posted by yetidude69
    Just wondering if this map exists?
    I don't believe there is an overall map available and published - individual forces will have there own databases that might well be subject to the Data Protection Act.

    or is it the police just using this as excuse?
    Excuse for what? Can you explain a bit more?

  3. #3
    What map?

    Ask the police to see it and talk you thro it. Why would it be against the DPA it is a map of the land you can get from the OS [if it exists]

    Sounds like another dreamt up piece of bullsh*t oh sorry I meant latest non legal, legal requirement by those half wits in the FEO dept.

    Which force area is it?

  4. #4
    As far as I am aware the police don't have a map showing the exact areas, they have a database of addresses by farm/estate name against which they store the calibre it's cleared to, when it was last checked, who cleared it etc and in the case of Avon & Somerset who has permission to shoot there, if known.

    Alex

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Rangefinder
    Why would it be against the DPA it is a map of the land you can get from the OS [if it exists]
    I think you have misread what I wrote - "individual forces will have there own databases that might well be subject to the Data Protection Act." I wasn't referring to a published map - OS or any other.

    As someone else has said:
    Quote Originally Posted by csl
    they have a database of addresses by farm/estate name against which they store the calibre it's cleared to, when it was last checked, who cleared it etc and in the case of Avon & Somerset who has permission to shoot there, if known.
    That could be quite sensitive information in the wrong hands - either those with criminal intent or the anti brigade. If it isn't subject to the DPA then I suspect it would be restricted at the very least.

    I'm still wondering what prompted the OP to raise the issue though?

  6. #6
    Just curious to know if it was just the polices excuse to not allow certain calibres when there is a sufficiant backstop!

    just regaurding using 308 for foxes as i have it as my deer rifle and they dont deem .22rf a suitable round!

    cheers guys

  7. #7
    If your FAC is conditioned to allow you to use the .308 for deer but not fox and you are experiencing resistance from the police to allow that calibre for other quarry, then you might want to draw their attention to this (from BASC):

    The Association of Chief Police Officers (ACPO) Firearms and Explosives Licensing Working Group (FELWG) has issued advice that supports Chapter 13.14 & 13.22 of the Home Office guidance. It advised police forces to allow larger calibre rifles to be used to take lesser species i.e. where the primary reason for possession e.g. deer stalking was established, all lesser species such as foxes and pests could be shot. This practice has been commonplace in Scotland for some time, and has not endangered public safety in any way.

    In June 2009 ACPO FELWG again advised forces of a new condition that can be used in place of the standard condition in Appendix 3 of the Home Office guidance.

    The (rifle/sound moderator/firearms/ammunition) shall be used for shooting (Named Principal Quarry Species) and any other lawful quarry, on land deemed suitable by the chief officer of police for the area where the land is situated, and for zeroing on ranges, over which the holder has lawful authority to shoot. (Delete italics where appropriate).

    This identifies the primary reason for use e.g. deer/fox control, then allows “other lawful quarry”.


    If on the other hand you are saying that you already have a certain piece of land cleared for .22RF, and they won't allow .308 as you are restricted to specified land only, then it's a different kettle of fish. The Home Office Guidance (13.11) states that where possible the applicant should be present when an inspection takes place in order to demonstrate that they understand the characteristics of the land and the best places to shoot safely on it. You could request to be there and put your case directly to the FEO.

    If all else fails and you think they are wrong in their appraisal, (is the FEO in anyway qualified to undertake inspections?), you could request the reason for refusal in writing - it might focus their thinking - and take it from there.

    Have a look in the Legal Issues section of the forum for other information on the subject.

  8. #8

    land

    Yeti, All this probably comes from trying to service an application from a new shooter, lets say someone wanting to shoot a centrefire on a half acre paddock with absolutely no backstops where the same half acre formed in a steep sided fold in the ground would get cleared, possibly with a notation that fire should be directed in one line only, then again the paddock might be deemed ok with fire only from a high seat, this is maybe ok if you get a decent FEO doing the land check, these land checks are then logged with the local licensing dept, these clearances or refusals are subject to a shelf life & will in time expire, local forces will collaborate where asked by other forces, this can also include info on quarry species present, then you have the shooter with a completely unrestricted fac who rolls up & makes his or her own mental land check on arrival.

  9. #9

    Re: land

    Quote Originally Posted by finnbear270
    possibly with a notation that fire should be directed in one line only, then again the paddock might be deemed ok with fire only from a high seat
    Finn,

    Don't you think that trying to exercise control to the nth degree like that just illustrates what a complete waste of time the inspection process is - other than to support the 'good reason' for possesion in the first place? This constant drive by police firearms departments to control every aspect of sporting shooting is made totally redundant as soon as the holder of an 'open' FAC sets foot on the land - all of their, no doubt carefully constructed, restrictions go straight out of the window!

    Like some of our continental nighbours, it would be far better to licence the person rather than waste time and public money making up nonsense about which firearm is 'safer' than others in a given environment.

  10. #10
    I would be happy to see the police counties fall by the wayside, why not have one police force? one licencing system, one rule for all? If it's ok to merge military forces that have been in existence since god knows when why should they be any different? was'nt that done for money saving so called reasons?

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