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Thread: reason for 1-for-1 variation

  1. #1

    reason for 1-for-1 variation

    Out of curiosity, has anyone had to justify a one-for-one variation?

    I had to spend about 15 mins of the phone explaining my logic, in the face of some fairly trenchant scepticism. It seemed that 'the rifle I got first time round was not what I wanted in terms of accuracy and function and I would like to get a better one' wasn't regarded as a particularly good reason.

    The system seems predisposed to obstruction, inefficiency and needless delay. Could anyone explain why we need to get authority to replace a rifle once granted the authority to posess one in that calibre? It makes no sense.

  2. #2
    Never had to give any reason other than "deer stalking + fox control" during variation


  3. #3
    Quote Originally Posted by Mungo View Post
    Out of curiosity, has anyone had to justify a one-for-one variation?

    I had to spend about 15 mins of the phone explaining my logic, in the face of some fairly trenchant scepticism. It seemed that 'the rifle I got first time round was not what I wanted in terms of accuracy and function and I would like to get a better one' wasn't regarded as a particularly good reason.

    The system seems predisposed to obstruction, inefficiency and needless delay. Could anyone explain why we need to get authority to replace a rifle once granted the authority to posess one in that calibre? It makes no sense.
    Mungo

    I haven't come across this before.
    In the past I have just sold a rifle, notified the FA Team asking them to keep the slot open got my FAC back and repurchased in the same calibre using the open slot and notified the FA Team again. It's a cumbersome and unnecessarily bureaucratic process in my view but I've not faced any questioning. Is that what you did or did you do something different? I'm curious

  4. #4
    Mungo

    I may have got the wrong end of the stick. Replacing a rifle in the same calibre isn't a Variation. I'm not clear on what you've done. Can you explain?

  5. #5
    I would guess their reluctance is down to an attempt at reducing costs.

    they have to process and issue a new certificate. That will incur admin and stationary costs. Given the current drive in Police Scotland to save millions of pounds I'm guessing even a few quid here and there eventually adds up to a reasonable figure. Let's be honest, the current firearms licensing system is antiquated at best and will always cost the police endless expense until we see a system like chip and pin and a computerised link between the FAC holder, the RFD and the police...

    Only reason really for questions would be if the chambering your looking at is questionable for the purpose it's intended for...

  6. #6
    I phoned them up to ask what the appropriate course of action was (I had not done a 1-for-1 before). They said to send in my FAC and an application for a variation BEFORE disposing of the existing rifle. They would then add a condition to the cert stating that I had the authority to obtain a new .308 once the current one was gone.

    So filled in the application and sent it all off.

    Two weeks later (!) I finally phoned to find out what was going on, and got passed on to the enquiry officer. He then grilled me about why I wanted to do this, and was rather sceptical about it. The exact question was 'well, you've only had this one for 5 months - why do you need to change it?'. And was grudging about accepting that 'poorer performace than expected' as an answer. He wanted to know who I'd be selling my existing rifle to, and why they would take it if it wasn't good enough for me. I'm pretty certain that these are not questions he's entitled to ask.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by jamross65 View Post
    Only reason really for questions would be if the chambering your looking at is questionable for the purpose it's intended for...
    I could understand that. But .308 for roe, red and fallow? When I already have authority to possess one, based on a thorough investigation the last time round?

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by jamross65 View Post
    the current firearms licensing system is antiquated at best and will always cost the police endless expense until we see a system like chip and pin and a computerised link between the FAC holder, the RFD and the police...
    Now wouldn't that be lovely!

    Walk into RFD. Swipe card. Current status pops up on screen. Sell rifle. RFD taps in details. Status updated. Buy new rifle. RFD taps in details. Swipe card again. Walk out.

    If farm shops in the middle of nowhere can manage a web based ordering system with a loyalty card and secure online payment, there is no earthly reason why they can't do this for FACs. Antediluvian, knuckle dragging, chin dribbling dinosaurs.

  9. #9
    Just being tricky I believe, they want to save money/cut workload and not encourage use to own firearms.

  10. #10
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    It beggars belief that these FEOs don't know that the British FAC system prevents you to being able to "try before you buy".

    And, that as I did, if you get a "lemon" that can it takes weeks or months before you decide it isn't a faulty 'scope, loose 'scope mountings, poor bedding, too slow/too fast handloads that are causing the problem but something fundamental the rifle itself.

    A gun shop isn't like "American Golf" warehouse or a club's "pro-shop" where you can send down a few shots before you decide to buy or not!

    And that as the RFD can't try before he/she buys neither can they nor, either, if you put the thing for sale via an RFD with an auction house.

    And the bottom line? Well if it isn't new the reason that it was up for sale was that previous owner may also have had the same issues with it too!

    Like Sherlock Holmes you have to eliminate all the other possibilities until the only one that remains, no matter how implausible, is the only solution. That it isn't your input that is the reason for its poor performance but the rifle itself!

    I had one rifle that I took to the range ten or twenty times, different loads, replacement 'scope, etc., etc., until finally admitting that it had to go.
    Last edited by enfieldspares; 11-12-2013 at 09:47.

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