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Thread: Rifle and calibre conumdrum

  1. #1

    Wink Rifle and calibre conumdrum

    Hi guys, yes itís another calibre thread but one I could use a bit of input with.

    Iím putting this in the big game thread as the intended rifle would be mostly used for overseas hunting and maybe a bit of use back here for visitors needing to borrow a rifle or a spare if my working gun is in the shop.

    First I think I should give you a bit of background on my current setup before we get to the meat of it. Currently for my overseas rifles I have 2 rigs the first is a M03 in .30-06, it fitís me like a glove and is great up close on moving targets with the 1-6x24 Swaro and I have a second 3-12x56 Ziess in itís own QD mounts for use as a general purpose rifle. My second rifle was bought as a mountain and plains rifle after a trip out to northern Namibia which highlighted my lack of experience at longer range shooting. Itís a Sako 85 SS hunter in 7mm Rem mag with a Khales 4.5-18x50, a real track driver and with the scope using either the ret for holdover or dialling in (Yeah like I ever have time for that) I feel happy shooting out to around 4-500 yards.

    Now the 7mm is for use overseas hunting in places and at ranges that are outwith the norm for general Deer Stalking over here so please bear that in mind and letís not have a long range rage thread or I will ask the Mods for a lock.

    I have been looking for a way to combine these two rifles now for quite while but I keep coming up short. The main reason I would like to do this is since Rigby is back in London and now producing a .416 in semi obtainable money I would like to finish off my inventory with a Big Game rifle. However I would like to make some space and simplify my ammunition requirements which currently covers 150 grain .30-06, 180 grain .30-06 and 162 grain 7mm Rem mag. The latter two are becoming more sporadic and I have to order them in more often than not, which means I have to travel to the other side of Scotland to pick it up.

    Iíve thought long and hard about a .300 Win Mag but I borrowed one once and it kicked the living daylights out of me and Iím a big enough lad 6í 1Ē 90kg and very fit. It might have just been the rifle itself an old Ruger 77 All Weather with a rubbish plastic stock but I donít have fond memories of the .300.

    Iím looking for suggestions on calibre and possible rifle combinations including scopes. The suggested rifle could be used on Boar in Croatia, Chamois in the Austrian mountains, Zebra on the plains and Kopies of Namibia or Eland in wait a minute thorn. Also the calibre must be available the world over. I suppose that maybe I should just keep the two rifles as such a thing may not be effectively possible but I thought I would ask the question, thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    Hi Snagman,
    You have an intersting situation to resolve ! Choice of calibre is a very personal thing, and you have covered the options well. I think you might have been unfortunate in your experience with the 300win mag. If you can cope with the 30 06 in 180 grain, and the 7mm Rem mag in 162 grain, I would have thought the 300 win mag should not have beaten you up. If you are going to spend money on getting it "right", I would go for the 300 win mag in a custom stock that really fits you, and is of adequate weight, and is designed to give you a cheek weld with the scope you fit, (which may mean an adjustable comb), and you have the ideal rifle for African Plains Game at full range. I believe Mike Norris (on SD) uses one to great affect in Africa.
    Hope this helps, John.

  3. #3
    Why not a second barrel on the Mauser in another cal ? I had a similar problem and went for the .300 WM as a second barrel which I have used on two international trips on my Mo3. A friend of mine went for a .375 on his Mo3 for international forays but also added the stock suppressor to reduce recoil. That adds probably 500 grams but it is removable between trips.

  4. #4
    Quote Originally Posted by Marcher View Post
    Hi Snagman,
    You have an intersting situation to resolve ! Choice of calibre is a very personal thing, and you have covered the options well. I think you might have been unfortunate in your experience with the 300win mag. If you can cope with the 30 06 in 180 grain, and the 7mm Rem mag in 162 grain, I would have thought the 300 win mag should not have beaten you up. If you are going to spend money on getting it "right", I would go for the 300 win mag in a custom stock that really fits you, and is of adequate weight, and is designed to give you a cheek weld with the scope you fit, (which may mean an adjustable comb), and you have the ideal rifle for African Plains Game at full range. I believe Mike Norris (on SD) uses one to great affect in Africa.
    Hope this helps, John.
    I have been kind of leaning towards this option, it's just I'm somewhat reserved about going through all the rigmarole and then having a custom gun built only for me not to like it. Recoil isn't generally an issue for me certainly I put a good few rounds through my CZ .375 before I sold her and I have no qualms shooting a .416 but it was the short sharp smack I got from the .300 that put me off, I can only assume that the stock was too short and narrow.
    I'll have to think about it a bit more, thanks for the input.

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by prometheus View Post
    Why not a second barrel on the Mauser in another cal ? I had a similar problem and went for the .300 WM as a second barrel which I have used on two international trips on my Mo3. A friend of mine went for a .375 on his Mo3 for international forays but also added the stock suppressor to reduce recoil. That adds probably 500 grams but it is removable between trips.
    Hi Prometheus,
    I had considered just getting a 7mm Rem mag barrel for the M03 but I would quite like to just have a single setup so I only have one standard rifle for overseas. Certainly if I just re calibre I would likely do it with the M03 for simplicity.

  6. #6
    You don't mention the accuracy of your .30-06. Are you not as confident in it for long range work as in your Sako 7mm RM? Because the .30-06 can certainly shoot as flat as 7mm RM for all practical purposes. And with a good 200-gr bullet, at the ranges one expect to encounter such things, it will shoot almost lengthwise through a Grizzly bear. There's your Eland rifle. And the M03 takes down for easy packing.

    And why the .416 Rigby? How much would you get to use it? An angry Cape Buffalo is the only thing I can think of where a .375 H&H might not be sufficient to break bones.

    Some of my traveling rifles are Tikka T3 SS in .30-06, Steyr 7x64 with iron sights and QD rings, SIG SHR 970 in .280 Rem.... so my suggestion is to keep what you have and buy something lighter, like a Tikka T3 SS or Sako Finnlight in .270 Winchester.

  7. #7
    Quote Originally Posted by Southern View Post
    You don't mention the accuracy of your .30-06. Are you not as confident in it for long range work as in your Sako 7mm RM? Because the .30-06 can certainly shoot as flat as 7mm RM for all practical purposes. And with a good 200-gr bullet, at the ranges one expect to encounter such things, it will shoot almost lengthwise through a Grizzly bear. There's your Eland rifle. And the M03 takes down for easy packing.

    And why the .416 Rigby? How much would you get to use it? An angry Cape Buffalo is the only thing I can think of where a .375 H&H might not be sufficient to break bones.

    Some of my traveling rifles are Tikka T3 SS in .30-06, Steyr 7x64 with iron sights and QD rings, SIG SHR 970 in .280 Rem.... so my suggestion is to keep what you have and buy something lighter, like a Tikka T3 SS or Sako Finnlight in .270 Winchester.
    I am confident with the .30-06 it shoots around an inch to inch and a half from field positions and smaller off a bench but I've had better luck with the 7mm RM at ranges over 300 yards on large bodied game, I might be wrong but it just seems to have more oomp and penetrate better than the .30-06 at range in my experience. I've never pushed the .30-06 past 300 yards as I had the 7mm RM for that so I can't say yay or nay since it's not set up for shooting at longer ranges but it's a thought.

    The .416 Rigby is actually for Buffalo might be a few more years but I do intend to go after one.

    As for picking up another rifle for traveling I am a bit limited by licensing over here which is why I would like to bring the two rifles together into one unit. I have a .270 as my working gun but it is not useable as an overseas rifle. I had looked into .280 Remington a while ago but ammo is basically non existent for my location, 7x64 is a bit better. I do reload but I don't want to use reloaded ammo in Africa as I can't replicate the conditions here for proper testing.

    Good stuff keep it coming guys.

  8. #8
    +1 30-06 available everywhere and well proven

  9. #9
    I have been sat here trying to think what I would do if I was in you position. I have no experience with the Mo3 but it does sound like you are trying to get 10lb of s**t into a 5lb bag. A 30.06 and a .375 set up in your M03 would give you a lot of options and you can get ammunition anywhere in the world. Add the fact that you can swap out your scopes and you are in business. If you didnt like the 300wm then a .416 might not be for you. If you just fancy a big game rifle, then that is something different. Having never hunted a Buffalo a don't have a lot of experience but I wouldnt like to try it with anything smaller than a .375 and I cant imagine shooting antelope at 400m with a .375 either. Lots of different ways to do it but a 30.06 and a .375 would take some beating. I would love an excuse to buy a 9.3 barrel and an aimpoint for my Blaser Not a bad problem to have.

    Ezzy

  10. #10
    Quote Originally Posted by ezzy6.5 View Post
    I have been sat here trying to think what I would do if I was in you position. I have no experience with the Mo3 but it does sound like you are trying to get 10lb of s**t into a 5lb bag. A 30.06 and a .375 set up in your M03 would give you a lot of options and you can get ammunition anywhere in the world. Add the fact that you can swap out your scopes and you are in business. If you didnt like the 300wm then a .416 might not be for you. If you just fancy a big game rifle, then that is something different. Having never hunted a Buffalo a don't have a lot of experience but I wouldnt like to try it with anything smaller than a .375 and I cant imagine shooting antelope at 400m with a .375 either. Lots of different ways to do it but a 30.06 and a .375 would take some beating. I would love an excuse to buy a 9.3 barrel and an aimpoint for my Blaser Not a bad problem to have.

    Ezzy
    Heh yeah that's quite an apt quote for this situation. It's a bit tricky as I feel my current rigs cover me very well such as if I'm going hunting in the thick stuff take the .30-06 or if I'm heading out on the plains or mountains take the 7mm RM both have advantages and drawbacks but each is tailored to do a job and I'm beginning to think that no one rifle could really do it all.

    As for the .416 Rigby I found it not too bad in the recoil department of the 2 rifles I fired it in more of a big shove compared to the short smack of the .300 but both rifles fitted me pretty well, I don't know if it was this or the lower pressure of the cartridge but it didn't bother me. But I don't want to use the M03 for Dangerous game as I'm not happy with the set up as a DG rifle I would rather a dedicated rifle for that, the M03 scope mount bridge makes top loading a big magnum cartridge difficult and it's got a detachable mag which I don't want on a DG rifle.

    I really don't know, a friend suggested I get rid of my old .270 working gun and start using the .30-06 in it's place but they again are very different rifles. Maybe I just need to suck it up and try out a couple of .300 rifles or get another safe for the .416 when it comes around if old plod is fine with another rifle.

    But again some good stuff keep the feedback coming guys.

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