tick are out

berg

Well-Known Member
with the spring here so to a are little woodland friends the ticks , I shot a little buck yesterday pm and it was covered in ticks all over it back and it legs were covered when I gralloch it the subs were fine and so were the rets but the mesenteric was swollen when I cut it open a creamy liquid came out white blood cells doing they job I put it down to the heavy tick burden and the body trying to fight of the infection cause by the ticks at this level this is the third time I have noticed this has any one else had any similar findings??
 
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With that level of infestation and pus filled nodes I'd be suspecting something else wrong with that deer.

Why? A heavy tick burden and slight swelling of some glands is normally just a sign that the animal is a little unwell. I'm sure the glands in your own neck have been 'up' when you were unwell, but I doubt you've ever had TB? We are not in a TB area. It's just the bodies imune system doing its job. There may well be something else slightly wrong, but it is of little concern.
MS
 
With that level of infestation and pus filled nodes I'd be suspecting something else wrong with that deer.
As i work in the meat trade and i was at the slaughter house this morrning pick 25 new season lambs for tomorrow i grabed one off the meat inspectors and told him about it ,he told me not to worrie about TB as we dont have any recored cases of it this far over east (yet) but what i should be looking for a custard texture puss not a watery one and that other than TB the mesenteric only normaly swells from something it has ingestid ?as the subs and rets were ok not to much to worrie about pretty much what m/s said.But a word of warnning make sure that you were disposable glove at all time s during the gralloch as TB is transferable to humans in this way be very carefull when cutting open glads .and said i should carry sanitizer in the car and wash down after gralloching , i do anyway but i bet theres a few die hards out ther that dont even were gloves :cuckoo:
 
As i work in the meat trade and i was at the slaughter house this morrning pick 25 new season lambs for tomorrow i grabed one off the meat inspectors and told him about it ,he told me not to worrie about TB as we dont have any recored cases of it this far over east (yet) but what i should be looking for a custard texture puss not a watery one and that other than TB the mesenteric only normaly swells from something it has ingestid ?as the subs and rets were ok not to much to worrie about pretty much what m/s said.But a word of warnning make sure that you were disposable glove at all time s during the gralloch as TB is transferable to humans in this way be very carefull when cutting open glads .and said i should carry sanitizer in the car and wash down after gralloching , i do anyway but i bet theres a few die hards out ther that dont even were gloves :cuckoo:

Feck. I never wear gloves. :scared:
 
Feck. I never wear gloves. :scared:
Thats up to you but if you do pick somthing up and i know there people that have caught some kind off bacterial virrus like e.coli off animals of working in the slaughter house ,ok not just becouse they weren,t wearing glove and 2 off them were back to work within a week or two but one chap was so ill for months and they couldn't fined out what was causing it , he was shi#ing water lost loads of weight and had to move out off his house as his wife was worried that the kids might catch something :drool:. what we do that affects us is up to use but when you could put others at risk it might be worth thinking a little harder .basic hygine takes no time at all the gloves are not there to stop your hands from getting blood on them , it proventing cross comtamination both ways.
 
Thats up to you but if you do pick somthing up and i know there people that have caught some kind off bacterial virrus like e.coli off animals of working in the slaughter house ,ok not just becouse they weren,t wearing glove and 2 off them were back to work within a week or two but one chap was so ill for months and they couldn't fined out what was causing it , he was shi#ing water lost loads of weight and had to move out off his house as his wife was worried that the kids might catch something :drool:. what we do that affects us is up to use but when you could put others at risk it might be worth thinking a little harder .basic hygine takes no time at all the gloves are not there to stop your hands from getting blood on them , it proventing cross comtamination both ways.

Oh, I always have gloves in my stalking pack but just never remember to use them! :cool:
 
Why? A heavy tick burden and slight swelling of some glands is normally just a sign that the animal is a little unwell. I'm sure the glands in your own neck have been 'up' when you were unwell, but I doubt you've ever had TB? We are not in a TB area. It's just the bodies imune system doing its job. There may well be something else slightly wrong, but it is of little concern.
MS

There has to be a first case some time. Just because Suffolk isn't a TB area doesn't mean you shouldn't consider it. If that's your attitude why bother checking at all?
 
There has to be a first case some time. Just because Suffolk isn't a TB area doesn't mean you shouldn't consider it. If that's your attitude why bother checking at all?
that why I spoke to someone with more knowledge than my self, and as we are in the middle off east Anglia it would have to spread to us ,so we would know it was coming its not spread by midges or air born like foot and mouth it dose not just appear at random.but your right we need to look ,and I just got of the phone to a friend who has a small roe to burn as it has a worn infestation thats the second on this year from the same wood
 
There has to be a first case some time. Just because Suffolk isn't a TB area doesn't mean you shouldn't consider it. If that's your attitude why bother checking at all?

Of course, all wild deer should be thoroughly inspected! I generally shoot about 150 wild deer a year in this area and can assure you that every one of them gets a good inspection!
However, when you've shot enough deer, you do get to know what is good or bad. There are a multitude of reasons why any of the glands can be raised, and if you look hard enough on every deer you can probably find something slightly 'abnormal'. The trouble is now in the stalking world, we are faced with this growing and almost 'fear culture' that any slight abnormality is now 'notifiable' in almost every instance! Being able to distinguish between them is clearly essential and that can only come with knowledge and experience. The Mesenteric chain is a bit like a fingerprint - they are all different! Some will be a continuous line, some will be broken and some will be little more than a couple of lumps. They will also change size according to general health. It is also the one gland which you can always check despite placement of shot and a good indicator of TB if indeed the animal is infected. If it is TB, it should be fairly obvious. If you are not sure it is always better to seek the knowledge of someone else. Another good aid is the little booklet sold by the BDS which you can carry with you into the field.
MS
 
Why? A heavy tick burden and slight swelling of some glands is normally just a sign that the animal is a little unwell. I'm sure the glands in your own neck have been 'up' when you were unwell, but I doubt you've ever had TB? We are not in a TB area. It's just the bodies imune system doing its job. There may well be something else slightly wrong, but it is of little concern.
MS
I never mentioned TB, just 'something else'.
A heavy parasite Infestation often occurs when a wild animal is on its way out.
 
I'm no vet (just a lowly medical doctor) but I would doubt that the mesenteric nodes are as a result of the ticks. If something was systemic from the ticks then all other glands would show enlargement. The likely hood is as has been said the animal was sick and that the mesenteric nodes would point to a primary gut pathology. The tick burden just a sign of a sick animal.
if it is a gut pathology then gloves are a must as e.coli can be cross infected as I am sure can also a host of other nasties.
 
I think it's were you shoot as we'll one area we stalk in Northumberland and all the deer seem to carry ticks also I thought best practise now was not to incise swollen lymph nodes a nd get veterniary advice
Atb Tom
 
I'm no vet (just a lowly medical doctor) but I would doubt that the mesenteric nodes are as a result of the ticks. If something was systemic from the ticks then all other glands would show enlargement. The likely hood is as has been said the animal was sick and that the mesenteric nodes would point to a primary gut pathology. The tick burden just a sign of a sick animal.
if it is a gut pathology then gloves are a must as e.coli can be cross infected as I am sure can also a host of other nasties.
ok I agree with that but when you look at he amount of ticks and they all leave those yellow puss marks witch are quite apparent when you skin them if you had a hundred of these then your body would be fighting the multitude of infections thus your glands having to work over drive to cope that in its own right would make you feel pretty ill .you know when you get a splinter from steal your whole finger gets hot ,well times that by 100 and you would be sick as. That was my take on it . But as said the meat inspector said it was more likely that the animal had something that it ingested . after speaking to some others IN THE NO I decided it is fit for the food chain but it makes you think that what we look at, yes we can see if its not normal but the rest is guess work for 90% of us on here. but 90%will claim they are the 10%:!:
 
ok I agree with that but when you look at he amount of ticks and they all leave those yellow puss marks witch are quite apparent when you skin them if you had a hundred of these then your body would be fighting the multitude of infections thus your glands having to work over drive to cope that in its own right would make you feel pretty ill .you know when you get a splinter from steal your whole finger gets hot ,well times that by 100 and you would be sick as. That was my take on it . But as said the meat inspector said it was more likely that the animal had something that it ingested . after speaking to some others IN THE NO I decided it is fit for the food chain but it makes you think that what we look at, yes we can see if its not normal but the rest is guess work for 90% of us on here. but 90%will claim they are the 10%:!:
I agree it probably is fit for found chain. But the way the lymph glands work is they swell up closest to the infection which would fit with the something ingested theory. Stomach glands wouldn't swell in isolation from a skin infection.
 
I agree it probably is fit for found chain. But the way the lymph glands work is they swell up closest to the infection which would fit with the something ingested theory. Stomach glands wouldn't swell in isolation from a skin infection.
I expect when I cut it up it leg glands will swollen an d the inner leg is quite near to the stomach?
 
Of course, all wild deer should be thoroughly inspected! I generally shoot about 150 wild deer a year in this area and can assure you that every one of them gets a good inspection!
However, when you've shot enough deer, you do get to know what is good or bad. There are a multitude of reasons why any of the glands can be raised, and if you look hard enough on every deer you can probably find something slightly 'abnormal'. The trouble is now in the stalking world, we are faced with this growing and almost 'fear culture' that any slight abnormality is now 'notifiable' in almost every instance! Being able to distinguish between them is clearly essential and that can only come with knowledge and experience. The Mesenteric chain is a bit like a fingerprint - they are all different! Some will be a continuous line, some will be broken and some will be little more than a couple of lumps. They will also change size according to general health. It is also the one gland which you can always check despite placement of shot and a good indicator of TB if indeed the animal is infected. If it is TB, it should be fairly obvious. If you are not sure it is always better to seek the knowledge of someone else. Another good aid is the little booklet sold by the BDS which you can carry with you into the field.
MS

I am playing devils advocate a bit here. Just as you have noticed a "fear culture" I would say I have seen the opposite. Complacency amongst stalkers. Many don't check at all so to disregard TB just because East Anglia is it a TB area is a touch callous. In all probability this wasn't TB or anything particularly nasty, although some pictures of the gland would have been helpful. I have seen TB and I'm sorry but I isn't always "fairly obvious" especially in the early stages of infection. I'm not a vet obviously but would a phone call to the AHVLA have hurt in this case, they would have been able to tell over the phone if it definitely wasn't suspect and if they had any concerns they would have sent a vet out.

My my point is the OP found something during his gralloch that concerned him enough to contact a friend and then post on here. What if it had been early TB? What did he do with the carcass and viscera? How far did he transport it?

I never mentioned TB, just 'something else'.
A heavy parasite Infestation often occurs when a wild animal is on its way out.[/QUOTE
,why would a healthy deer not get a infestation ?

I think that what Limulus is getting at is that very often a deer with a large parasite burden also has something else wrong with it, as if one is a result of the other, maybe the parasites are pulling on its immune system leaving it weak and open to other infections or maybe tick burden is higher on a deer that is already under the weather. Who knows?
 
I am playing devils advocate a bit here. Just as you have noticed a "fear culture" I would say I have seen the opposite. Complacency amongst stalkers. Many don't check at all so to disregard TB just because East Anglia is it a TB area is a touch callous. In all probability this wasn't TB or anything particularly nasty, although some pictures of the gland would have been helpful. I have seen TB and I'm sorry but I isn't always "fairly obvious" especially in the early stages of infection. I'm not a vet obviously but would a phone call to the AHVLA have hurt in this case, they would have been able to tell over the phone if it definitely wasn't suspect and if they had any concerns they would have sent a vet out.

My my point is the OP found something during his gralloch that concerned him enough to contact a friend and then post on here. What if it had been early TB? What did he do with the carcass and viscera? How far did he transport it?

I think that what Limulus is getting at is that very often a deer with a large parasite burden also has something else wrong with it, as if one is a result of the other, maybe the parasites are pulling on its immune system leaving it weak and open to other infections or maybe tick burden is higher on a deer that is already under the weather. Who knows?
like I said I spoke to a meat inspector .and if they don't know what there talking about then who dose .we pay them enough money to check every animal that gose to slaughter .ihave learnt a lot from speaking to them over the years
 
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